Your Controversial Opinions on DT

[TheGreatPretender]

I see. But I don't have any problems with samples on Space-Dye Vest and HTF, and the sections they are featured in would be more boring without them.

Well, the section in Honor Thy Father maybe could use a guitar solo or something of the sort if the samples were taken out. But I don't agree with SDV at all. My whole problem with those samples is that they distract from the beautiful piano melodies underneath. Thank God there are instrumental cover versions on Youtube that don't feature the samples.

[puppyonacid]

SFAM and SDOIT are both far more consistent than Awake. Awake has the half hour of hatred dragging it down. SFAM and SDOIT don't have anything I don't like on them. IaW would be near perfect except for LTL dragging it down.

WUT???!!!

[BlobVanDam]

SFAM and SDOIT are both far more consistent than Awake. Awake has the half hour of hatred dragging it down. SFAM and SDOIT don't have anything I don't like on them. IaW would be near perfect except for LTL dragging it down.

WUT???!!!

Yeah, I'm not much of a fan of it. I don't hate it, but it's easily my least favourite on IaW, and wouldn't make my top 50.
Most of the song is great, but I think the earlier verses and the chorus have really weak melodies and phrasing from trying to fit those lyrics to the music. Those earlier vocals just aren't anywhere near as melodic as the rest of the song or the album imo, and it hurts the song a lot as a whole for me.

[puppyonacid]

Ok. I guess I can cope with that.

Although you're still wrong about Awake. Scarred is a fabawesome song.

[Tick]

I see some are saying that DT has lost there soul without Mike Portnoy. No to be mean but the thing they lost the most of are the cheesiest moments from the last couple albums when he was here.

[BlobVanDam]

Ok. I guess I can cope with that.

Although you're still wrong about Awake. Scarred is a fabawesome song.

If fabawesome is some code word for dreadful, then I'd agree.

I see some are saying that DT has lost there soul without Mike Portnoy. No to be mean but the thing they lost the most of are the cheesiest moments from the last couple albums when he was here.

[Sycsa]

I see some are saying that DT has lost there soul without Mike Portnoy. No to be mean but the thing they lost the most of are the cheesiest moments from the last couple albums when he was here.

Like what? For me, the cheesiest moments were always related to their ballads and that wasn't on MP.

[Tick]

I see some are saying that DT has lost there soul without Mike Portnoy. No to be mean but the thing they lost the most of are the cheesiest moments from the last couple albums when he was here.

Like what? For me, the cheesiest moments were always related to their ballads and that wasn't on MP.

Hell no! I love a good ballad! Why is a ballad cheesy if its well written?

I thought stuff like..."DAY AFTER DAY, AND NIGHT AFTER NIGHT..." THAT is cheesy to me. I accept it...but its cheese.

[puppyonacid]

Ok. I guess I can cope with that.

Although you're still wrong about Awake. Scarred is a fabawesome song.

If fabawesome is some code word for dreadful, then I'd agree.

It tickles me how much you hate that song 

[BlobVanDam]

Ok. I guess I can cope with that.

Although you're still wrong about Awake. Scarred is a fabawesome song.

If fabawesome is some code word for dreadful, then I'd agree.

It tickles me how much you hate that song 

I'm glad my pain amuses you!




I'm listening through DT's studio material, and I just skip from UAGM straight to New Millennium. :dealwithit:

[Sycsa]

I see some are saying that DT has lost there soul without Mike Portnoy. No to be mean but the thing they lost the most of are the cheesiest moments from the last couple albums when he was here.

Like what? For me, the cheesiest moments were always related to their ballads and that wasn't on MP.

Hell no! I love a good ballad! Why is a ballad cheesy if its well written?

I thought stuff like..."DAY AFTER DAY, AND NIGHT AFTER NIGHT..." THAT is cheesy to me. I accept it...but its cheese.

It's not, who said that? What I said what when DT gets cheesy, it's usually in their ballads. Far from Heaven, Beneath the Surface, cut me a break. Their cheesiest ballads ever, right after MP left. I still like the majority of them though, after a certain period of adjustment.

Citing "Day after day" for the thousandth time is still a weak argument to put all the "bad, cheesy stuff" on MP. From his playing and the way he talks about music, I think he has a great taste.

[Tick]

I see some are saying that DT has lost there soul without Mike Portnoy. No to be mean but the thing they lost the most of are the cheesiest moments from the last couple albums when he was here.

Like what? For me, the cheesiest moments were always related to their ballads and that wasn't on MP.

Hell no! I love a good ballad! Why is a ballad cheesy if its well written?

I thought stuff like..."DAY AFTER DAY, AND NIGHT AFTER NIGHT..." THAT is cheesy to me. I accept it...but its cheese.

Hell no! I love a good ballad! Why is a ballad cheesy if its well written?

It's not, who said that? What I said what when DT gets cheesy, it's usually in their ballads. Far from Heaven, Beneath the Surface, cut me a break. Their cheesiest ballads ever, right after MP left. I still like the majority of them though, after a certain period of adjustment.

Citing "Day after day" for the thousandth time is still a weak argument to put all the "bad, cheesy stuff" on MP. From his playing and the way he talks about music, I think he has a great taste.
[/quote]
Its not weak, its valid, no matter how many times its said. Should I point to Dark Eternal Night as well? I am not going to start ripping apart the band regarding everything Mike has done. I just feel some people think the last 2 albums are sorely lacking his presence. I simply don't agree. That is all.

[Sycsa]

  we thoroughly fucked up the quotes in the last two posts. Anyway, I agree with your last thought, the band is better off without him, at the same time, I wouldn't be so quick to blame everything that was wrong with them up to BCSL on him. And TDEN is awesome!

[Zook]

MP's singing is certainly something I'm not going to miss. His backing vocals and trade off stuff like in The Glass Prison were fine, but then for SC and BCSL he started that "tough guy" crap, and that was cheesy. The Shattered Fortress is just as heavy as The Glass Prison. There was no need for the faux tough guy voice. It's not embarrassing or anything. I still love TSF, it's one of the better songs on BCSL, it's just those vocals are silly.

[m0hawk]

I sorely miss Portnoy's anger. There was such a desperation that he brought to the music that I haven't found in the Mangini era. I'm glad the band is far happier these days, and it really shows in the music. There is such joy in the last 2 albums that makes me happy. But still, I hope they once again find that anger...

[TheGreatPretender]

When it comes to MP's harsh vocals, I didn't mind them so much. The raps on Prophets and Nightmare were enjoyable, the back and forth on Constant Motion was cool. What I REALLY hated among MP's contributions were the backup screams, most evident in the first verse in AROP and the chorus of TCOT. Things like that brought the songs down for me big time.

[Grizz]

I enjoy how the shouting adds the over-the-top feel in TCoT. Complements the music and lyrics nicely.

[TheGreatPretender]

I enjoy how the shouting adds the over-the-top feel in TCoT. Complements the music and lyrics nicely.

Well, if you like it, more power to you. Actually, it is the verses that bug me more. "Let me introduce! My brotha!" Those parts are the ones I didn't like.

[Nearmyth]

If DT can re-incorporate that aggressiveness or anger without the cheesiness, it could make for a great formula with what they've got going on now.

[rumborak]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

[BlobVanDam]

After listening to FII again the other day, I have decided TAMP is actually an underrated and pretty good song, and better than any of their recent ballads.

[Dream Team]

After listening to FII again the other day, I have decided TAMP is actually an underrated and pretty good song, and better than any of their recent ballads.

Yup 

[Dream Team]

Not really controversial, but I think DT would sound even better if they incorporated more straight-ahead rock n roll beats, riffs, and solos into the instrumental sections.

[Prog Snob]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

This definitely has some merit.  99% of the people I talk to about DT denote their biggest complaint being the vocals.  The other 1% claim DT are overachievers. 

[rumborak]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

This definitely has some merit.  99% of the people I talk to about DT denote their biggest complaint being the vocals.  The other 1% claim DT are overachievers. 

I used to be in that 99%. When a college friend of mine exposed me to DT through IAW (which at that time was the latest album), for the longest time I was really annoyed by the (to me) unnatural vocals.

[Tick]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

I understand where your coming from, but in the same token how much bigger can a prog metal become in this day and age? Since they are the biggest name in the genre you could make the case that this is as good as it can possibly get.

[TheAtliator]

I used to HATE James LaBrie, and now he's my favorite singer of all time, and my friends make fun of me for being obsessed like a freaking fan girl over this guy 

I think if you don't listen VERY closely to his voice, you hear something else than what he's actually doing and it sounds whiney. One day it just clicked with me when I was listening to PMU, and I realized Holy crap if you listen closely to his voice, there's SO MUCH more in it and he's actually not whining at all, and then it was uphill from there.

[rumborak]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

I understand where your coming from, but in the same token how much bigger can a prog metal become in this day and age? Since they are the biggest name in the genre you could make the case that this is as good as it can possibly get.

I see what you're saying, but look at a band like Radiohead that still got huge despite make some weird, weird-ass music. I think with a non-operatic, strong frontman (no offense to JLB, but he's not that strong a frontman), I think they could have tapped a lot more people. Not that I particularly approved of MP's bashing of James, but I totally understood where he was coming from.

[Tick]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

I understand where your coming from, but in the same token how much bigger can a prog metal become in this day and age? Since they are the biggest name in the genre you could make the case that this is as good as it can possibly get.

I see what you're saying, but look at a band like Radiohead that still got huge despite make some weird, weird-ass music. I think with a non-operatic, strong frontman (no offense to JLB, but he's not that strong a frontman), I think they could have tapped a lot more people. Not that I particularly approved of MP's bashing of James, but I totally understood where he was coming from.

Well, he obviously have a dated voice that got trapped in the 80's so the sound of his voice is certainly not in style these days.

But consider this...
Think about being the lead singer in a band like Dream theater. A band where the singer is not the focal point and never would be. How many vocalists would be able to check there ego at the door and accept that fact?
I think the beauty of James is that despite his voice not being every ones cup of tea, his strength lies in the fact he is able to embrace and accept his role.
Who knows...if not for James, guys as demanding as these guys are might have shot themselves in the foot by having a revolving door of singers over the years.
I don't think it can be over stated that there are not many vocalists who have the versatility of James that would be willing to play the role of just being a limited part of what they do. He does do that as well as anyone probably ever could.
I have always felt that way about James and respect him for it.

[BlobVanDam]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

I get the argument, so I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm still not really sure about that.
They're progressive metal. That alone already makes them a niche band, and by that measure, I think they're already pretty big for their genre. I'm not convinced a different singer with the same music would have resulted in them being huge, even despite the criticism of JLB's voice.
They obviously had the right singer at the right time with PMU, before the music landscape shifted away from that style of vocalist. Even after that, I don't know that anybody who otherwise would have loved their music would have been turned away from Awake by the vocals.
I think it's a more recent criticism, definitely at least post-vocal injury, and their fanbase during the '90s seems totally in line with what I'd expect for a band in their genre in their circumstances, regardless of vocalist.
And during the 2000s, their fanbase has steadily increased to a pretty admirable size. I wouldn't expect any prog metal band to be that much bigger than DT in this day and age.

Could they have done better with another vocalist? It's possible, although I'm just saying that the complaints of JLB's voice alone don't strongly convince me of that.

[Tick]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

I get the argument, so I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm still not really sure about that.
They're progressive metal. That alone already makes them a niche band, and by that measure, I think they're already pretty big for their genre. I'm not convinced a different singer with the same music would have resulted in them being huge, even despite the criticism of JLB's voice.
They obviously had the right singer at the right time with PMU, before the music landscape shifted away from that style of vocalist. Even after that, I don't know that anybody who otherwise would have loved their music would have been turned away from Awake by the vocals.
I think it's a more recent criticism, definitely at least post-vocal injury, and their fanbase during the '90s seems totally in line with what I'd expect for a band in their genre in their circumstances, regardless of vocalist.
And during the 2000s, their fanbase has steadily increased to a pretty admirable size. I wouldn't expect any prog metal band to be that much bigger than DT in this day and age.

Could they have done better with another vocalist? It's possible, although I'm just saying that the complaints of JLB's voice alone don't strongly convince me of that.

Not sure if you read my last couple posts? but man are you on the same page as me! You view it almost identically as I do!

[BlobVanDam]

Not sure if you read my last couple posts? but man are you on the same page as me! You view it almost identically as I do!

I was still typing my last one when you posted, but I saw the one before that.

[theseoafs]

Agreed with Blob and Tick.  I see no reason to believe that DT could have been any more successful with a different vocalist.

[Prog Snob]

My  controversial opinion of the day: I think James' singing held back DT from becoming big.

I get the argument, so I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm still not really sure about that.
They're progressive metal. That alone already makes them a niche band, and by that measure, I think they're already pretty big for their genre. I'm not convinced a different singer with the same music would have resulted in them being huge, even despite the criticism of JLB's voice.
They obviously had the right singer at the right time with PMU, before the music landscape shifted away from that style of vocalist. Even after that, I don't know that anybody who otherwise would have loved their music would have been turned away from Awake by the vocals.
I think it's a more recent criticism, definitely at least post-vocal injury, and their fanbase during the '90s seems totally in line with what I'd expect for a band in their genre in their circumstances, regardless of vocalist.
And during the 2000s, their fanbase has steadily increased to a pretty admirable size. I wouldn't expect any prog metal band to be that much bigger than DT in this day and age.

Could they have done better with another vocalist? It's possible, although I'm just saying that the complaints of JLB's voice alone don't strongly convince me of that.

Their popularity in the genre of prog metal is almost unmatched. However, I think breaking out past that boundary to reach a different audience was mostly hampered by the operatic-style vocals.  Every album of theirs since WDADU has had radio-friendly songs (in terms of both style and length), songs that if done by another band or maybe with a different singer would probably have given them more notoriety on popular radio.  Unfortunately once people associate a certain style or song with a band, it's tough to lose that stigmatization.  PMU did that to Dream Theater. 

[rumborak]

Agreed with Blob and Tick.  I see no reason to believe that DT could have been any more successful with a different vocalist.

Well, look at Prog Snob and I. Both of us really didn't like James' voice. I personally stuck with them because I liked the music too much, but a lot of people I have spoken to have said verbatim "the music is pretty cool. But the singer, sorry."

And again, playing weird music doesn't immediately mean you're confined to a tiny segment of listeners. Radiohead again being the prime example.