Teen kills herself due to trolling.

[Chino]

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/07/hannah-smith-suicide-cyberbullying_n_3714687.html?utm_hp_ref=technology

First off, this is very sad and I feel bad for the girl and her family.

I will now bring up the following quotes;

" But these trolls need to realize that they are affecting people's lives in the most horrific ways imaginable."

"The suicide of a young British teen is renewing awareness of cyberbullying, with parents and anti-bullying advocates calling for an end to anonymous online harassment."

"These sick people are just able to go online and hide behind a mask of anonymity while they abuse vulnerable teenagers"

"How many more ­teenagers will kill themselves because of online abuse before ­something is done?"

That being said, these parents are out of their minds. Do they honestly believe that even the most drastic measures taken will have if anything a negligible effect on trolling? Vulnerable teenagers? Do your job as a parent if it's that big of a concern to you. My parents had an internet spying program on my sister's computer for three years between the ages of 13-16. They could see every key press and character displayed on her machine. I'm not trying to sound like a dick, but if your kid kills themselves because of trolls on the internet, there was something much more concerning going on in their lives that went unnoticed. The internet is fucking huge, they could easily find a place where they wouldn't be trolled and harassed.

I don't understand why the internet is expected to be this safe place for children. It isn't. If you let your kid roam free with no supervision, it's your own fault if something happens to them. All funny cat pictures and Youtube videos aside, the internet is fucking terrifying when you think about it. A few wrong clicks and you could go missing in a matter of hours. Why parents trust it or their childrens' use of it is beyond me.

[jsem]

but if your kid kills themselves because of trolls on the internet, there was something much more concerning going on in their lives that went unnoticed.

I completely agree.

[Kotowboy]

but if your kid kills themselves because of trolls on the internet, there was something much more concerning going on in their lives that went unnoticed.

I completely agree.

+ 1 and chuck in people who commit mass murders who "happened" to enjoy metal. Metal is always blamed. I really agree that if you have it in you to walk into a school with a machine gun and blow people away - your choice of music is not a trigger. It's you.

I bet if those people were found to have enjoyed Mozart or Beethoven - that wouldn't even get mentioned.

[sueño]

I don't understand why the internet is expected to be this safe place for children. It isn't. If you let your kid roam free with no supervision, it's your own fault if something happens to them. All funny cat pictures and Youtube videos aside, the internet is fucking terrifying when you think about it. A few wrong clicks and you could go missing in a matter of hours. Why parents trust it or their childrens' use of it is beyond me.

THIS!!!

You might as well allow your child to roam the streets alone and at all hours.  It is the responsibility of PARENTS to help their children feel safe and secure.  The internet - wonderful, though it is - is a wild country.

And very much agreed with the statement that something more must have been going on besides anonymous bullying that you don't even have to go see.  I was bullied as a child by real people.  I did EVERYTHING I could to avoid them, go different ways home from school, etc...ultimately involving my parents and teachers in the situation.

Point is -- I tried to avoid it, I didn't go where it was.  The internet can't "get" you unless you turn it on.  That's a tragic situation but I do believe it was avoidable.

[Zook]

This is sad, but why didn't she just stop going to the site?

[jammindude]

This is sad, but why didn't she just stop going to the site?

It's not always that easy.   And it's not always just trolling.   Stalking is an incredibly creepy thing.  I've been affected recently by a stalker.   But I keep thinking, why should MY OL social life be ruined just because they won't leave me alone?

Sadly...I may just have to shut down my OL life altogether.   But I'm almost afraid that if I do that, this person will go to even more drastic measures.

I've been very afraid lately....

[Jaq]

I knew a young lady at a forum that I moderated at a few years ago that ran afoul of some cyber bullies. She left the forum and moved her online life elsewhere.

They FOLLOWED her, still bothering her. She moved again. They made a site strictly to harass her and ridicule her.

As of two years ago, this was still going on...even though they'd lost track of her online life when she got married...and it began in 2005. Six years of trolling and ridiculing and hassling someone who has no contact with these people, over something that honestly even she's forgotten.

Yeah, sometimes it isn't as easy as just not going to a website.

[Dark Castle]

It's sad, because a lot of people just put off internet bullying as if it doesn't really hurt.
People do need to realize that, I'm so sick of people saying "It's just the internet, don't get so butthurt about it"
Well you know what? Words can still hurt.

While saying that, if I run into internet bullying, I usually just leave wherever it's happening, if I made any friends there, there are other ways to keep in contact without having to put up with relentless personal attacks.

[Super Dude]

I knew a young lady at a forum that I moderated at a few years ago that ran afoul of some cyber bullies. She left the forum and moved her online life elsewhere.

They FOLLOWED her, still bothering her. She moved again. They made a site strictly to harass her and ridicule her.

As of two years ago, this was still going on...even though they'd lost track of her online life when she got married...and it began in 2005. Six years of trolling and ridiculing and hassling someone who has no contact with these people, over something that honestly even she's forgotten.

Yeah, sometimes it isn't as easy as just not going to a website.

I was a victim of that in high school. Not fun stuff, made worse by the fact that they were also guys who went to my school and so everyone in my social circle at the time had access to the site too.

In this case, like sueño said, it's just like any other lapse in parental supervision, be it a teen going missing at a rock concert or something of that nature. And to be affected by something like that, surely the problems couldn't have been confined to just her online social life, and that too is something they ought to have found out about.

[LCArenas]

Look this is incredibly sad and tragic but blaming the internet for this and demanding things to be done to control it isn't gonna work. Parents need to teach their children not to let the insults of others break them, and not only on the internet: people will humiliate them in school, talk shit behind their back in college/university, and be a complete hypocrite to them in adult life. Things like this are to be found not only here, but in every place where you find yourself interacting with people. The Internet, and only some parts of it, are an exaggerated version of that since you can do it anonymously. But you can't expect you children to live in a bubble completely isolated from the reeking assholes of this world, let alone expect that other people isolate them for you.

[j]

I don't understand why the internet is expected to be this safe place for children. It isn't. If you let your kid roam free with no supervision, it's your own fault if something happens to them. All funny cat pictures and Youtube videos aside, the internet is fucking terrifying when you think about it. A few wrong clicks and you could go missing in a matter of hours. Why parents trust it or their childrens' use of it is beyond me.

This synopsis deserves quoting again.

-J

[Jaffa]

While I agree that it's pretty silly to just blame the internet, I don't think it's fair to lay all the blame on the parents, either.  From what I've read and listened to, this girl went online to ask questions about a medical condition, and somehow that led to people bullying her and telling her to kill herself.  Should she have let their comments get to her?  No.  Should she have been asking these questions online in the first place?  Probably not.  Should her parents have been more closely monitoring what was going on in their daughter's life?  Absolutely.  But none of that changes the fact that people bullied her and told her to kill herself.  To me, those people definitely bear some of the responsibility for what happened. 

I'm sure (or at least I hope) they didn't actually expect her to do anything.  They were probably just joking around.  But really, is that an excuse?  They've got such a warped sense of humor that they think telling a stranger to commit suicide is somehow funny?  To me, that's not an excuse, that's just utterly fucking depressing. 


Again, I'm not saying we should blame the internet.  In fact, I'm not really trying to make a point at all.  Just venting, I guess.  I just can't believe the world sometimes. 

[robwebster]

Seriously? Some of you guys are defending the trolls?

Man.

"It's the internet, what do you expect" is exactly the attitude that makes the web a playground for anonymous psychopaths. She was a victim, and they got their rocks off by indulging her fantasies. Depression is a sickness, and a very distressed young girl found a site that told her, repeatedly, that everything she believed about herself was right. I don't think it's any wonder she was fascinated by it. I have no respect for anyone whose idea of fun is to make a stranger's life a little bit worse, and I don't have much more for anyone who tries to justify it.

No good.

[Jaffa]

Well, to be fair, I don't think anybody's necessarily defending the trolls.  I think they're reacting more to the idea that the government should police the internet to deal with the trolls.

But yeah, I agree with your general sentiment.  To me, 'if you can't take it, stay off the internet' is a bit like 'if you aren't bulletproof, don't get shot.'  Yeah, okay, sound logic and all, but the shooter is still a problem that needs to be addressed. 

[sueño]

Well, to be fair, I don't think anybody's necessarily defending the trolls.  I think they're reacting more to the idea that the government should police the internet to deal with the trolls.

But yeah, I agree with your general sentiment.  To me, 'if you can't take it, stay off the internet' is a bit like 'if you aren't bulletproof, don't get shot.'  Yeah, okay, sound logic and all, but the shooter is still a problem that needs to be addressed.

Agree.  I think that many are saying that it's very important for parents to monitor what their kids are up to and to keep communication as open as possible.  I know many parents who keep the family computer in a high-traffic area in the home - kitchen or living room, not each one in a bedroom and have definite periods of usage outlined.  And they are very strict about the sort of cell phones their kids are allowed. 

We can't protect kids from everything online any more than out in the street.  And if someone is hurt, the ones who did it are just as culpable, IMO, as a shooter would be.  But the first line of defense is always looking to one's own protection, isn't it?  I know I'm not defending online bullies at ALL but I would hold myself responsible for my child's online activities -- not the government or anyone else.

[TioJorge]

These people are the scum of the earth; a fucking cancer. That said, much like cancer, these cockroaches cannot be completely stopped. We can treat, we can try, but there will always be more in the woodwork, ready to come out at a moments notice. This is where parenting comes in. Truth be told, if this girl wanted to kill herself, no amount of therapy, parenting, or any other 'treatment' is going to help; but the fact that the parents are now all up in arms over this makes me want to shove a soldering iron down their throat. Goddamn morons, they are.

Yep, no fucking shit, these trolls are horrible people and they've done terrible things. But if they were as angry before she killed herself as they are now, they might have actually been able to at the very least attempt to help her out. Now, chances are these people will not be caught, no justice will be served, and they more than likely couldn't give a shit less. Some might even revel in it. You want to stop things like this from happening? PAY SOME FUCKING ATTENTION TO YOUR CHILD, YOU IGNORANT CUNT.

Parents like this make me want to sterilize this disgusting fucking species. Prevention is the best weapon against people who berate, bully and otherwise torture their victims...these naive parents couldn't possibly be any more ignorant about this situation. It is foolhardy, ignorant, and downright stupid to think that this can actually be stopped by any type of policing. Monitored? Sure. Still gonna happen; shit, it'll more than likely spur any trolls that were already berating people to do so even more and even more harshly. The answer isn't in action after the fact, it's keeping your children monitored, keeping up with their life, talking to them, and above all, being open as possible so that they don't feel the need to keep shit like this bottled up.

All said and done, nothing is going to change the way of the internet unless a major, gigantic, cataclysmic change occurs in the internet itself. This online wasteland is free, open, and all around archaic; for as much as it has advanced, it's given people who bully and berate that much more freedom to do so. Knowing this, the only option to prevent this and help people out is not to foolishly attempt to actually police the internet...it's to do something in the real world, with your actual child. But this concept is probably long lost to most parents that act like this is a big fucking surprise when they probably had every opportunity to help but did absolutely nothing. Too little, too late.

Sad indeed. It's also something that can be battled and prevented. By PARENTS.

[Super Dude]

Well, to be fair, I don't think anybody's necessarily defending the trolls.  I think they're reacting more to the idea that the government should police the internet to deal with the trolls.

But yeah, I agree with your general sentiment.  To me, 'if you can't take it, stay off the internet' is a bit like 'if you aren't bulletproof, don't get shot.'  Yeah, okay, sound logic and all, but the shooter is still a problem that needs to be addressed.

This. There are free speech complications that make the whole thing a mess, so a much easier and more effective way of at least reducing the risk of this sort of thing is to just be more aware of your kids' online activities.

[FourthHorseman]

I think that, at least in a child's early life, self esteem (and self confidence) is something that should be reinforced and taught by parents.

[Super Dude]

Which is a great idea on its own, but I can tell you from experience that it's hard even with great love of self to withstand constant barrages by bullies. They're persistent because they want to wear you down, which eventually they do.

[Jaffa]

I think the thing that bothers me about these discussions is that I never hear anybody talking about the parents of the bullies.  We always talk about the parents of the victims, and how they could have raised their children better to help them survive in the big bad world.  Why don't we talk about the parents who raised the children that are making it a big bad world?  Aren't they the ones who need parenting lessons?  Aren't they the ones who should be taking a more active role in monitoring their children on the internet? 

[bout to crash]

Lots of interesting points in here. I agree- fuck people who tell a girl to kill herself, and bullying in all forms is serious... BUT there was clearly a lot more going on with her.

+ 1 and chuck in people who commit mass murders who "happened" to enjoy metal. Metal is always blamed. I really agree that if you have it in you to walk into a school with a machine gun and blow people away - your choice of music is not a trigger. It's you.

I bet if those people were found to have enjoyed Mozart or Beethoven - that wouldn't even get mentioned.

[sueño]

To this, many times the bullies *are* adults, sad to say.

If not, then yes, I would hold parents responsible...if you can get to them.  Just like the law goes after the parents of juvenile offenders for some crimes now.  Sometimes.     There are some rotten parents out there but they probably are not any more aware of their kids' online activities than those of the victims.   Again, I think the better solution (at least one that can be better controlled) is to look after and try to protect and empower your own kids.

[Mister Gold]

Interesting turn of events on this...

THE website Ask.fm, on which Hannah Smith, 14, received hate messages before she was found hanged, has provoked further controversy by claiming she posted many of the comments herself.

Ask.fm executives are understood to have said privately that the company has analysed the profiles of the senders of the bullying messages and concluded that Hannah had set up most of the anonymous identities herself and sent the vast majority of the messages.

"With the Hannah case, the company have looked at every identity — the IP addresses are trackable. She posted the anonymous things herself. The police has all that data," a source claimed.

In private briefings last week, the company said "98%" of the messages had come from the same IP address as Hannah's, with about four posts that had not.

https://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/Tech/article1298958.ece

Thoughts?

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

 



Pretty much sums up my reaction.

[Implode]

Wow, that is awful. It's a shame, because there are people that do get real harassment on the internet. :/

[Zook]

So she was just looney tunes... Sad.

[Orbert]

Sounds like real schizophrenia.  Multiple personalities, some of which hate the other, and she ends up actually tormenting herself online.

[Mister Gold]

Sounds like real schizophrenia.  Multiple personalities, some of which hate the other, and she ends up actually tormenting herself online.

Agreed.

I wouldn't be surprised if the other four messages that came from other IPs than the one at her house were messages she sent to herself from various computers open for public use, such as those at a local library or her school. She could have also utilized a computer at one of her friends or relatives' homes.

[Lucien]

How very strange...

[Jaffa]

Oh. 

Well then. 

... I really don't know how to react to this. 

[aprilethereal]

It was already disturbing before, but if what Mister Gold quoted is the truth, that's just terrible. I feel very bad for the girl

[robwebster]

Crikey.

Unless she had siblings, that's... fairly nightmarish. Man. And if she had siblings, different kind of nightmarish. Poor girl.

Still. Anonymous trolls are a very real and dangerous thing, and if nothing else, her death is getting people - certainly in the UK - to take a serious look at the internet and accountability. Freedom of speech is good - freedom from accountability is less so. Holding the website owners accountable for what happens in their back yard seems wise, and encourages administrators of bigger websites who may not be particularly involved in the communities they're peddling to think a little bit more about how their product is being used. There's a balance to be struck, but we sure as hell haven't got there yet.

[Kotowboy]

Lots of interesting points in here. I agree- fuck people who tell a girl to kill herself, and bullying in all forms is serious... BUT there was clearly a lot more going on with her.

+ 1 and chuck in people who commit mass murders who "happened" to enjoy metal. Metal is always blamed. I really agree that if you have it in you to walk into a school with a machine gun and blow people away - your choice of music is not a trigger. It's you.

I bet if those people were found to have enjoyed Mozart or Beethoven - that wouldn't even get mentioned.

*Fictional Character*

Cool Story Bro.

[Mister Gold]

Crikey.

Unless she had siblings, that's... fairly nightmarish. Man. And if she had siblings, different kind of nightmarish. Poor girl.

Yeah, this was another thought that was running through my head last night. Just because the messages came from her IP address, it doesn't mean that she was definitely the person that posted them on her page. It could have also been an abusive parent or sibling that found her page and harassed her online too.

However, I'd be surprised if this ever gets figured out. Either she had a very extreme mental health issue, such as Dis-associative Identity Disorder, and one or more of her different personalities harassed her via the Internet, or she lived in an abusive environment. Neither are pleasant to think about.

[TioJorge]

Whoa... That's outlandish. It's sad that this was revealed, and quite frankly if I were in charge of that investigation, I wouldn't let that information out for the sake of letting this do some good. Now it's just going to put every ounce of blame on her and the whole bullying aspect, which is still a huge problem, will be completely overtaken. No good will come from this, and the ironic thing is that her parents are apparently even more incompetent and oblivious than previously thought. She may have been deranged, but even this was a form of calling out for help, more than likely. Even more sad, even more useless...