MP new interview "the 12 SS is completely my concept and my baby..."

[nikatapi]

Well, probably MP feels a little bitter about how everyone moved on, both Dream Theater and the majority of the fans, and with every chance he gets he tries to stay in the spotlight.
Whatever, keep making music, if you are not happy with the outcome, the success, or the money, remember it was your choice to leave the band, and in bands you can't always have your way, there are other people involved.

[hefdaddy42]

MP has really gone off the deep end.  Maybe it's all part of his self-fulfilling rock icon delusion where he puts himself so far above anyone else he basically thinks he's God... and can create and destroy bands at-will and after 25 years all us regular folk will "get it" as the master plan it was this whole time and how far ahead of our time he was musically and blah blah blah.

Why do other artists even want to work with such a delusional egomaniac?  As soon as he decides it's over, it's over, and then the bridges get burned down and he moves on.  There is another organism on this planet that behaves in such a way... a virus.

You need to tone it down.  This looks like outright bashing to me.

[King Postwhore]

Hef, you're on vacation.  No working.

[rumborak]

Gotta love Portnoy. Where would this forum be without him. We'd be making daisy chains and skipping around on meadows, and who wants that shit anyway.

[Stadler]

Hahaha, didn't take long to be able to read a post and be able to tell the poster just by the content.  Some of you WOULD criticize Mike no matter what he says.

"He's not being honest!"  "He's too honest!"  "He's only telling his side of the story" "He shouldn't give all those details!"

Please.

All of this - all the statements, the tweeets, the re-tweets - are all made in the context of the relationship between the parties and we are NOT those parties.   How do any of you know for a fact that the "Portnoy/Petrucci" comment was meant with malice?  How do you know that wasn't an olive branch of sorts for John?   We should have learned from Lennon/McCartney, Jagger/Richards, and/or Simmons/Stanley that these things are complicated and not easily analyzed from the outside.


As for the playing of songs/suites, while there are no legal restrictions generally, the parties can agree to anything they want.  If DT was willing, and received what they felt was fair compensation in return (need not be money) they can certainly agree that they will not perform some or all of the suite.   This is not uncommon at all, and I don't see what the uproar is.   Mike can ask for whatever he wants, and DT can give him whatever they want.  Why is the idea of two entities reaching an agreement on something so offensive to so many people (especially if you don't have an axe to grind against one or both of the entities)?

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

Hahaha, didn't take long to be able to read a post and be able to tell the poster just by the content.  Some of you WOULD criticize Mike no matter what he says.

"He's not being honest!"  "He's too honest!"  "He's only telling his side of the story" "He shouldn't give all those details!"

Please.

All of this - all the statements, the tweeets, the re-tweets - are all made in the context of the relationship between the parties and we are NOT those parties.   How do any of you know for a fact that the "Portnoy/Petrucci" comment was meant with malice?  How do you know that wasn't an olive branch of sorts for John?   We should have learned from Lennon/McCartney, Jagger/Richards, and/or Simmons/Stanley that these things are complicated and not easily analyzed from the outside.


As for the playing of songs/suites, while there are no legal restrictions generally, the parties can agree to anything they want.  If DT was willing, and received what they felt was fair compensation in return (need not be money) they can certainly agree that they will not perform some or all of the suite.   This is not uncommon at all, and I don't see what the uproar is.   Mike can ask for whatever he wants, and DT can give him whatever they want.  Why is the idea of two entities reaching an agreement on something so offensive to so many people (especially if you don't have an axe to grind against one or both of the entities)?

My problem isn't that he gives details and is honest, it's that he presents them when everyone else has moved on, and typically in a seemingly contrived way to make light of himself. If he wants to be open and talk about the situation, whatever... It's hard to believe it's still a thing by now, but he can say what he wants, it's just that for the sake of everyone, he should try not to be an arse.

Also, that statement may not have been meant with malice, but it sure makes it sound like "the magic of DT is gone without me". That may not have been what he meant, and if it isn't he should probably be a little more more clear. If it is what he meant, then I completely disagree with him 100% and I think it's a rude and pointless comment.
Also, of course this stuff is complicated. If you think it shouldn't be analyzed from the outside, I would think you would have a problem with MP tweeting and Facebooking everything to the public. That's why I think it's more respectful of the current members of DT to move on and keep it private.

Also, I don't think anybody is offended by the idea of an agreement, just with him acting as if he wrote and deserves creddit for 100% of the 12SS.

[Setlist Scotty]

Also, I don't think anybody is offended by the idea of an agreement, just with him acting as if he wrote and deserves creddit for 100% of the 12SS.

And therein is where the problem lies, because he NEVER EVER claimed to be responsible for for writing the whole thing himself. Yes, he came up with the concept, probably came up with some musical ideas, encouraged other ideas out of the guys and was probably largely responsible for the arranging of those songs, but he never claimed as if he wrote it, nor is he acting like he did. He'll be the first to tell you himself. But obviously, it is something that is deeply personal to him, so that is why he made the comment that he wished he would've included that in his agreement with DT, just as Tater did regarding the Mindcrime albums with QR.

[Madman Shepherd]

Hahaha, didn't take long to be able to read a post and be able to tell the poster just by the content.  Some of you WOULD criticize Mike no matter what he says.

"He's not being honest!"  "He's too honest!"  "He's only telling his side of the story" "He shouldn't give all those details!"

Please.

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

All of this - all the statements, the tweeets, the re-tweets - are all made in the context of the relationship between the parties and we are NOT those parties.   How do any of you know for a fact that the "Portnoy/Petrucci" comment was meant with malice?  How do you know that wasn't an olive branch of sorts for John?   

...and a branch of thorns to John Myung, James LaBrie, and Jordan Rudess? 

[Stadler]

My problem isn't that he gives details and is honest, it's that he presents them when everyone else has moved on, and typically in a seemingly contrived way to make light of himself. If he wants to be open and talk about the situation, whatever... It's hard to believe it's still a thing by now, but he can say what he wants, it's just that for the sake of everyone, he should try not to be an arse.

Well, in some instances, he's being asked a question.  I'd rather this current scenario than have him pull a "Blackmore" and have certain questions be off limits.   And as for the "arse" comment, see below...

Also, that statement may not have been meant with malice, but it sure makes it sound like "the magic of DT is gone without me". That may not have been what he meant, and if it isn't he should probably be a little more more clear. If it is what he meant, then I completely disagree with him 100% and I think it's a rude and pointless comment.
Also, of course this stuff is complicated. If you think it shouldn't be analyzed from the outside, I would think you would have a problem with MP tweeting and Facebooking everything to the public. That's why I think it's more respectful of the current members of DT to move on and keep it private.

Also, I don't think anybody is offended by the idea of an agreement, just with him acting as if he wrote and deserves creddit for 100% of the 12SS.

This whole section speaks WAY more about the listener than it does about Mike.   I didn't at ALL think it sounded like "the magic of DT is gone without me".   I took it totally like "we really had something special".   For all his enthusiasm for his current projects, he has no "Petrucci" now.   Even Neal Morse, while a collaborator, isn't the "Page" to Portnoy's "Plant".   I can see a guy like Mike, with his immense knowledge of music, and his respect for legacy and history (including his own) being wistful about not having that partner in crime anymore.   

As for the last thing, he DOES deserve 100% credit, at least for the concept!   It wasn't [insert other band member]'s sobriety that formed the basis of the lyrical concept.    If I was the interviewer, I would have asked him if he would have minded if the band did the suite instrumentally.   That would have been a good indicator of what he was really thinking about.

I truly believe if Mike said "I like ice cream!!" someone would complain that he dissed cheesecake, and he should really think more about what he tweets!!

[TAC]

Also, I don't think anybody is offended by the idea of an agreement, just with him acting as if he wrote and deserves creddit for 100% of the 12SS.

And therein is where the problem lies, because he NEVER EVER claimed to be responsible for for writing the whole thing himself. Yes, he came up with the concept, probably came up with some musical ideas, encouraged other ideas out of the guys and was probably largely responsible for the arranging of those songs, but he never claimed as if he wrote it, nor is he acting like he did. He'll be the first to tell you himself. But obviously, it is something that is deeply personal to him, so that is why he made the comment that he wished he would've included that in his agreement with DT, just as Tater did regarding the Mindcrime albums with QR.

It's amazing that some people have not grasped this concept yet.

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

[Madman Shepherd]

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

Do we seriously have to post everything in green that we intend to be sarcastic?  You can't possibly think there is a single person in the world who would take issue with an artist promoting their upcoming shows on twitter, can you?

I truly believe if Mike said "I like ice cream!!" someone would complain that he dissed cheesecake, and he should really think more about what he tweets!!

He just had a post about Indian food.  Find me one person that is offended he chose Indian food over a nice cold bowl of Borscht.

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

*raises hand*

[Madman Shepherd]

*raises hand*

JUST LET THE MAN EAT HIS FUCKING INDIAN FOOD!!!1!1

[Stadler]

...and a branch of thorns to John Myung, James LaBrie, and Jordan Rudess?

Maybe.  Maybe not.  As I said before, it is in the context of the parties' relationship and the context of the discussion.  The analogy was "Gilmour/Waters".   Not "Gilmour/Waters/Mason/Wright".   Perhaps Myung/LaBrie/Rudess would not be thin-skinned.  Perhaps they would look at it more positively, giving their bandmate of over 25 years the benefit of the doubt.   Perhaps they would have read the entire tweet string and recognized it wasn't a snub, but Mike was just keeping to the format.   Point isn't that I have the answer, the point is there are multiple possible answers and yours is only one (and an exceedingly negative one, at that). 

[TAC]

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

Do we seriously have to post everything in green that we intend to be sarcastic?  You can't possibly think there is a single person in the world who would take issue with an artist promoting their upcoming shows on twitter, can you?

Alright, man. I haven't read the entire thread to know your position. People have posted some crazy shit here, and your post was pretty outrageous. OK. Glad to know you weren't serious.

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

Also, I don't think anybody is offended by the idea of an agreement, just with him acting as if he wrote and deserves creddit for 100% of the 12SS.

And therein is where the problem lies, because he NEVER EVER claimed to be responsible for for writing the whole thing himself. Yes, he came up with the concept, probably came up with some musical ideas, encouraged other ideas out of the guys and was probably largely responsible for the arranging of those songs, but he never claimed as if he wrote it, nor is he acting like he did. He'll be the first to tell you himself. But obviously, it is something that is deeply personal to him, so that is why he made the comment that he wished he would've included that in his agreement with DT, just as Tater did regarding the Mindcrime albums with QR.

It's amazing that some people have not grasped this concept yet.

Okay, I was wrong to say he's acting like he wrote 100%. I should have said that it seems people don't like the idea of him getting rights to songs that had significant portions written by other members. I didn't actually mean he was trying to take 100%, I was trying to get a point across. You can read pretty easily what I think about the article right on the first page of the thread.

My problem isn't that he gives details and is honest, it's that he presents them when everyone else has moved on, and typically in a seemingly contrived way to make light of himself. If he wants to be open and talk about the situation, whatever... It's hard to believe it's still a thing by now, but he can say what he wants, it's just that for the sake of everyone, he should try not to be an arse.

Well, in some instances, he's being asked a question.  I'd rather this current scenario than have him pull a "Blackmore" and have certain questions be off limits.   And as for the "arse" comment, see below...

Also, that statement may not have been meant with malice, but it sure makes it sound like "the magic of DT is gone without me". That may not have been what he meant, and if it isn't he should probably be a little more more clear. If it is what he meant, then I completely disagree with him 100% and I think it's a rude and pointless comment.
Also, of course this stuff is complicated. If you think it shouldn't be analyzed from the outside, I would think you would have a problem with MP tweeting and Facebooking everything to the public. That's why I think it's more respectful of the current members of DT to move on and keep it private.

Also, I don't think anybody is offended by the idea of an agreement, just with him acting as if he wrote and deserves creddit for 100% of the 12SS.

This whole section speaks WAY more about the listener than it does about Mike.   I didn't at ALL think it sounded like "the magic of DT is gone without me".   I took it totally like "we really had something special".   For all his enthusiasm for his current projects, he has no "Petrucci" now.   Even Neal Morse, while a collaborator, isn't the "Page" to Portnoy's "Plant".   I can see a guy like Mike, with his immense knowledge of music, and his respect for legacy and history (including his own) being wistful about not having that partner in crime anymore.   

It does say a lot about the listener I guess, and that way of looking at it is probably more realistic.

And yes, he does deserve complete credit for the idea to put the AA suite into songs. I just don't think he should have exclusive rights to play them when the other members contributed a lot. I don't think there's anything wrong with him bringing it up, though.

[Setlist Scotty]

I should have said that it seems people don't like the idea of him getting rights to songs that had significant portions written by other members.
<snip>
And yes, he does deserve complete credit for the idea to put the AA suite into songs. I just don't think he should have exclusive rights to play them when the other members contributed a lot. I don't think there's anything wrong with him bringing it up, though.

Once again, he is not against the other guys playing individual songs that make up the 12SS. In fact, I doubt he'd take issue with them even playing the TGP/TDS combo. But playing all 5 songs together as the full suite is the issue he would want to have exclusively.

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

I should have said that it seems people don't like the idea of him getting rights to songs that had significant portions written by other members.
<snip>
And yes, he does deserve complete credit for the idea to put the AA suite into songs. I just don't think he should have exclusive rights to play them when the other members contributed a lot. I don't think there's anything wrong with him bringing it up, though.

Once again, he is not against the other guys playing individual songs that make up the 12SS. In fact, I doubt he'd take issue with them even playing the TGP/TDS combo. But playing all 5 songs together as the full suite is the issue he would want to have exclusively.

That's pretty much what I said on the first page of this thread.

I don't see anything wrong with what Mike said, given the context. And honestly I get why he wouldn't want them to do the whole thing without him.

I think you're right about this. He even said "If Dream Theater was to go out there and perform my five-song concept thing..." It seems to be them playing through the whole story he created is what would bother him, not individual songs.

I also said:

I think they all should be ABLE to, but playing the 12SS (altogether, not individual songs) should just be left alone out of respect, not because of legal bindings.

Which I said because I think a band should be able to play material released under it's name, especially when 4/5 members who also helped develop the suite are still there.

I never said that he was against the other guys played individual songs that make up the 12SS.

[Madman Shepherd]

...and a branch of thorns to John Myung, James LaBrie, and Jordan Rudess?

Maybe.  Maybe not.  As I said before, it is in the context of the parties' relationship and the context of the discussion.  The analogy was "Gilmour/Waters".   Not "Gilmour/Waters/Mason/Wright".   Perhaps Myung/LaBrie/Rudess would not be thin-skinned.  Perhaps they would look at it more positively, giving their bandmate of over 25 years the benefit of the doubt.   Perhaps they would have read the entire tweet string and recognized it wasn't a snub, but Mike was just keeping to the format.   Point isn't that I have the answer, the point is there are multiple possible answers and yours is only one (and an exceedingly negative one, at that).

You mean there are more opinions out there than just mine?  More interpretations of the tweet? Thanks for arguing against a point I never made.  This revelation blows me away. 

There are some people here that will take issue with anything I have to say!!!!!

[bosk1]

I should have said that it seems people don't like the idea of him getting rights to songs that had significant portions written by other members.
<snip>
And yes, he does deserve complete credit for the idea to put the AA suite into songs. I just don't think he should have exclusive rights to play them when the other members contributed a lot. I don't think there's anything wrong with him bringing it up, though.

Once again, he is not against the other guys playing individual songs that make up the 12SS. In fact, I doubt he'd take issue with them even playing the TGP/TDS combo. But playing all 5 songs together as the full suite is the issue he would want to have exclusively.

Exactly (as has repeatedy been said thoughout the thread).  And as has also been repeated, there is a HUGE difference between:  (1) On one hand, wistfully saying ("wistfully" is the perfect word here--thanks, Stadler) "gee, in hindsight, I guess it would have been cool if I had asked the rest of the band if they would agree to not play the entire 12SS, because that is something vey personal to me and was my concept" vs. (2) on the other hand, vindictively saying "I regret that I didn't legal force the band to give up all rights to ever playing the 12SS in its entirety."  I am as certain as can be under the circumstances that Mike was saying #1 and not #2.

[Zook]

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

Do we seriously have to post everything in green that we intend to be sarcastic?  You can't possibly think there is a single person in the world who would take issue with an artist promoting their upcoming shows on twitter, can you?

I truly believe if Mike said "I like ice cream!!" someone would complain that he dissed cheesecake, and he should really think more about what he tweets!!

He just had a post about Indian food.  Find me one person that is offended he chose Indian food over a nice cold bowl of Borscht.

Actually, the fact that he chose Indian food over Mexican does upset me a little.

[SystematicThought]

Also, of course this stuff is complicated. If you think it shouldn't be analyzed from the outside, I would think you would have a problem with MP tweeting and Facebooking everything to the public.

A7X did. I remember an interview back after they announced their new drummer that when MP came to them and said he quit Dream Theater, they told him that he should reconsider that and reexamine his decision. He said that he already put out his press release, which I don't think they thought was a good idea. In the same interview they said they didn't like how much he tweeted and used Facebook. They liked his openness with fans, but that some things are better left out of the public realm.

[TheGreatPretender]

A7X did. I remember an interview back after they announced their new drummer that when MP came to them and said he quit Dream Theater, they told him that he should reconsider that and reexamine his decision. He said that he already put out his press release, which I don't think they thought was a good idea. In the same interview they said they didn't like how much he tweeted and used Facebook. They liked his openness with fans, but that some things are better left out of the public realm.

Of course, I can't help but imagine at the time they were thinking something along the lines of, "Ah shit, all the DT fans are gonna blame us for this."
I don't blame them for asking him to reconsider.

[Madman Shepherd]

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

Do we seriously have to post everything in green that we intend to be sarcastic?  You can't possibly think there is a single person in the world who would take issue with an artist promoting their upcoming shows on twitter, can you?

I truly believe if Mike said "I like ice cream!!" someone would complain that he dissed cheesecake, and he should really think more about what he tweets!!

He just had a post about Indian food.  Find me one person that is offended he chose Indian food over a nice cold bowl of Borscht.

Actually, the fact that he chose Indian food over Mexican does upset me a little.

It might have something to do with John Myung being Mexican that influenced his decision 

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

A7X did. I remember an interview back after they announced their new drummer that when MP came to them and said he quit Dream Theater, they told him that he should reconsider that and reexamine his decision. He said that he already put out his press release, which I don't think they thought was a good idea. In the same interview they said they didn't like how much he tweeted and used Facebook. They liked his openness with fans, but that some things are better left out of the public realm.

Of course, I can't help but imagine at the time they were thinking something along the lines of, "Ah shit, all the DT fans are gonna blame us for this."
I don't blame them for asking him to reconsider.

I'm sure that was a very uncomfortable situation for them. Sort of like when you're a kid at a friend's and their parents start arguing, so you just sort of tell your friend to calm down because you want to come over again.
Despite the weird analogy, I really do think they handled the situation well.

[Zook]

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

Do we seriously have to post everything in green that we intend to be sarcastic?  You can't possibly think there is a single person in the world who would take issue with an artist promoting their upcoming shows on twitter, can you?

I truly believe if Mike said "I like ice cream!!" someone would complain that he dissed cheesecake, and he should really think more about what he tweets!!

He just had a post about Indian food.  Find me one person that is offended he chose Indian food over a nice cold bowl of Borscht.

Actually, the fact that he chose Indian food over Mexican does upset me a little.

It might have something to do with John Myung being Mexican that influenced his decision 

Are you implying that Portnoy doesn't like Myung because he's black?

[Madman Shepherd]

You're right.  100% of what he tweets/retweets INFURIATES ME!  I just checked out his twitter and can you BELIEVE he retweeted a post praising him for being able to drum AND air drums at the same time?!?!?!  THE NERVE!!!  I was going to leave it at that but I couldn't help but notice a day or two ago he promoted...yes, PROMOTED a Winery Dogs show.  What disgusting behavior!!!  No matter what he says I will be here to criticize it.  You have figured us Mike Portnoy hater taters out, Stadler. 

Is this post made in seriousness or sarcasm?

Do we seriously have to post everything in green that we intend to be sarcastic?  You can't possibly think there is a single person in the world who would take issue with an artist promoting their upcoming shows on twitter, can you?

I truly believe if Mike said "I like ice cream!!" someone would complain that he dissed cheesecake, and he should really think more about what he tweets!!

He just had a post about Indian food.  Find me one person that is offended he chose Indian food over a nice cold bowl of Borscht.

Actually, the fact that he chose Indian food over Mexican does upset me a little.

It might have something to do with John Myung being Mexican that influenced his decision 

Are you implying that Portnoy doesn't like Myung because he's black?

I have a right to say whats on my mind/tweet/retweet/like posts on facebook that I want to like!!!!

...but yes, thats exactly what I'm implying