Train of Thought vs. Your favorite from the Mangini era

[KevShmev]

Random poll, but I thought this might be fun.

Close call for me.  Train of Thought has aged really well for me, especially considering how much I wasn't a fan at first, and I might consider it their best post-6DOIT album, but it is close.  My favorite of the current era could really be any of the three from ADTOE, The Astonishing or Distance over Time depending on what day it is, but it's tough to say that I like any of them more than Train of Thought.

I will say, too, that I am really surprised by how well Train of Thought has aged. 

[bosk1]

Wow, this one is not close for me at all.  I like Train of Thought.  But it is definitely down near the bottom in the DT discography.  2 albums from the Mangini era are in my top 4: ADTOE and DT12.  And I'd rank d/t and probably TA above it as well.

[pg1067]

Interesting.

Train of Thought comes down to As I Am (great), Endless Sacrifice (great), Vacant (very good), Stream of Consciousness (my favorite DT instrumental) and In the Name of God (epic).  TDS and HTF are "just good" or meh.

ADTOE has my favorite Mangini-era song (BAI), two really good songs (BITS and Outcry), and the rest is either "just good" (OTBOA and BTS) or just meh.

DT12 has the epic Illumination Theory, two really good songs (TLG and AFTR) and four songs that are "just good" (and a couple of mostly throwaway instrumentals.

DOT has a bunch of good songs but nothing that has yet risen to the "great" level (S2N is probably the closest at this point).

TOT has also stood the test of time very well, so I'm going to give it the nod, but it's not a super wide margin.

[krands85]

ToT for me. It was the first DT album that hooked me, having come from more of a metal background and although I&W eventually overtook it as my #1, it's still my second favourite DT album.

Having said that, ADToE isn't far behind and is my #3 or maybe #4. It would be even closer, but FFH and BMUBMD drag it down a little, whereas I really like all the songs on ToT. Ballads are never my favourites, though I do still enjoy most of them - but for some reason I never liked FFH that much. A better ballad and BMUBMD being a bit shorter could have elevated the album above ToT.

The other MM albums aren't that close - D/T and The Astonishing are middle of the pack and DT12 is towards the bottom.

[Volante99]

Close call;

I would rank ToT and ADToE very closely, near the top of pack, but below their masterpieces (I&W, Awake and SFaM). Musically, ADToE is probably the better of the two, but ToT is more "fun" and I find myself listening to it more.

None of the other Mangini era albums come close in my opinion.

[TAC]

I think Train Of Thought is awesome...the songs that is. I prefer Live At Budokan, or the many bootleg versions of the songs rather than listening to the actual album. There's something about the production that really seems to downgrade the songs for me.

ADTOE
TA
Train Of Thought
D/T
DT12

[NoFred]

ToT easily. And at their release I would have voted for ADTOE and D/T, but they've settled in some since then.

[IDontNotDoThings]

I think I like every album from the Mangini-era more than TOT.

[gzarruk]

I think I like every album from the Mangini-era more than TOT.

Same here.

[Madman Shepherd]

ADTOE
DoT (two of my favorite in DT's catalog)


Train of Thought/DT12 (Tie...ITNOG and TBP are two of DT's best songs. Several other excellent songs. A few that are near the bottom as well)





















The Astonishing

[SwedishGoose]

Not even close.....

Train of Thought is to me good but not what I want from Dream Theater. It's metal alright but not very much prog. I rank it towards the bottom 3rd of the discography.

During the Mangini era they went out on a limb and did what they wanted, an album that broke new ground but is still definiteley Dream Theater. Fantastic compositions with beautiful recurring themes and fantastic instrumentation. The album also has James LaBrie's finest work in where he portrays multiple characters.
I'm of course talking about The Astonishing which is my favorite album of Dream Theater's discography.

[Cool Chris]

I loved ToT when it first came out, and loved when most of it was featured on the Budokan DVD. Haven't listened to either in a long time, but I can't go so far as to say they haven't aged well with me.

I love ADTOE, and like the other 3 MM releases very much.

ADToE by a slim margin over ToT.

[Mladen]

As much as I like Train of thought, it doesn't come close to A Dramatic turn of events and The Astonishing.

[Max Kuehnau]

Interesting poll, really. I like the songwriting on TOT (on all the Portnoy-era albums actually, apart from FII), the drumming is what ruins it for me (unfortunate, but I have my criteria, and this applies to every Portnoy-era album as well), but you've expected that already didn't you? . ADTOE is very close to perfection in every aspect (DT12 is as well), so it gets my vote.
Personal note: Listen to the live version of Endless Sacrifice on the Christmas album vs the album version. Night and day difference IMHO (cleaner execution by everyone, much easier to listen to for me), you might see what I mean (then again, you might not, taste is fine for what it is)

[MirrorMask]

Train of thought has relatively few songs - out of those seven, one is very short, one is instrumental (excuse me for loving James and wanting some singing in my songs), and another one I simply don't like at all (Honor Thy Father). It's also marred by the famous "wanking", that completely derails for 4-5 minutes Endless Sacrifice for example.

So, while I still like the album and its mood overall, I'd have to take Dramatic or even the experience of The Astonishing over that one.

[the_silent_man]

Train of Thought
Awesome album, they fully committed to the heavy angle and for me it really works. 

The only other album that comes very close is ADTOE, which I also love, but has production issues and is not quite as consistent.

Aside from ADTOE, there is overall a definite step down in quality since TOT for me.

[lovethedrake]

Subjectively, TA and especially DoT are ahead of TOT for me without question.   

Self titled is about equal and ADTOE way worse than TOT.

Objectively though TOT is probably a better album than all of them outside of maybe DoT.  I just personally don't like the style as much but they achieved what they were going for very well.

[Northern Lion]

What a good thread idea!

Both ADToE and The Astonishing are in my top 4 and The Astonishing rotates with 6DoIT and SFaM for the top spot.  So ToT already looses from the get go.

D/T still needs more time for me to rank properly, but overall I like it very much and I would probably rank it higher over all than ToT as well.

DT12 is middle of the road for me but contains some of my favorite DT songs; TBP, AFtR and IT.

I would rank ToT about even with DT12.  It is also middle of the road over all, but also contains some of my favorite songs; AIA, SoC and ItNoG.

In fact, if my favorite songs from those two albums were on one album, it would fiercly content with with my top three.  We could call it Train of Dream Theater 

I love ToT's heaviness and very much appriciate what the band was trying to do with it.  I also think the album has aged well and listening to it from beginning to end still makes me excited.

[hefdaddy42]

I like Train of Thought quite a bit, but not as much as A Dramatic Turn of Events.

[The Curious Orange]

Train of Thought had that edge that makes DT special. Octavarium had that edge that makes DT special. Nothing since has had it. Oh, it's been there in places, sure, but never consistently all the way through an album. Distance Over Time is the nearest DT have come, but it ain't no Train of Thought.

[geeeemo]

Train of Thought had that edge that makes DT special. Octavarium had that edge that makes DT special. Nothing since has had it. Oh, it's been there in places, sure, but never consistently all the way through an album. Distance Over Time is the nearest DT have come, but it ain't no Train of Thought.

I agree, all the pre-Mangini albums have that special DT thing...and I don't know if it is because I just discovered DT about 4 years ago, but after the initial 2 years of gorging myself on all their music, I have settled in choosing the Mangini music more than the pre-Mangini. Not sure why as my top 5 songs have 3 from pre-Mangini albums. Maybe because I just love ADToE and D/T is still new.

[Phoenix87x]

ToT is tied with Images and Scenes as my favorite DT album so I'm gonna go with ToT. It has a rage, fury and passion that I can really get behind, and really picks me up when I need it to.

I like the Mangini era albums a lot, but not on the level of Tot.

[The Walrus]

ToT is an album I don't think I've revisited in its entirety since I was a teenager - well over a decade at this point. I'll take any Mangini era release over it except the self-titled

[bluefox4000]

ToT was an album I HATED.....i mean loathed on release way back.  thought it was completly pandering to one chunk of fans in the base.  also just fake as hell.  BUT.........over time (i mean over years and years)  i grew to love it it so much.  In the Name of god being one of my fav DT tunes now.

However.  as far as Mangini era goes.  the self titled to me is one of my fav albums by anyone.  and it wipes the floor with ToT.

Mangini era as a whole has become  a bit rocky for me.  LOVED Turn of Events than self titled.  TA really is the height of bland to me (don't take that to mean i hate.  i don't i just find it bland and too damn long)  And DOT is a super mixed bag for me.

[hefdaddy42]

I would like to point out that Train of Thought is an excellent driving album.

[Dream Team]

I think I like every album from the Mangini-era more than TOT.

Same here.

Thirded

[KevShmev]

Not even close.....

Train of Thought is to me good but not what I want from Dream Theater. It's metal alright but not very much prog. I rank it towards the bottom 3rd of the discography.

I say this in the nicest way possible, but can't that be a good thing?  Some of my favorite albums ever, by various bands, were ones where I was wanting something else than what they gave me (Awake, for example).  And often times, it's not like I can even specifically say, "I wanted this," but after an initial listen or two I thought, "Whatever I wanted, it wasn't this," but time has a funny way of revealing everything.  And it's not like I am calling Train of Thought my favorite DT album (it's not) or an all-time great (I can't go that far), but once enough time has passed and I have can look back at it with a little bit of perspective, it can be pretty exciting to realize that one of my favorite bands threw me such a curveball, one that I did not see coming, and for me Train of Thought now falls under that banner.  And it's funny to think that when Octavarium was released, I breathe a huge sigh of relief, like, "Okay, this is the Dream Theater I want," as it was balanced, warm and proggy, yet here we are in 2019 and I now consider Train of Thought to the superior record of the two by a pretty good margin.

[Lethean]

I think I like every album from the Mangini-era more than TOT.

Same here.

Thirded

Me as well.  But I love Train of Thought - it's a great album.  I just think the Mangini albums are even better.

[SwedishGoose]

Not even close.....

Train of Thought is to me good but not what I want from Dream Theater. It's metal alright but not very much prog. I rank it towards the bottom 3rd of the discography.

I say this in the nicest way possible, but can't that be a good thing?  Some of my favorite albums ever, by various bands, were ones where I was wanting something else than what they gave me (Awake, for example).  And often times, it's not like I can even specifically say, "I wanted this," but after an initial listen or two I thought, "Whatever I wanted, it wasn't this," but time has a funny way of revealing everything.  And it's not like I am calling Train of Thought my favorite DT album (it's not) or an all-time great (I can't go that far), but once enough time has passed and I have can look back at it with a little bit of perspective, it can be pretty exciting to realize that one of my favorite bands threw me such a curveball, one that I did not see coming, and for me Train of Thought now falls under that banner.  And it's funny to think that when Octavarium was released, I breathe a huge sigh of relief, like, "Okay, this is the Dream Theater I want," as it was balanced, warm and proggy, yet here we are in 2019 and I now consider Train of Thought to the superior record of the two by a pretty good margin.

It could have been, had I been a bigger fan of for instance Metallica and Megadeath.
It's cool enough music and works at certain times but it's not something I choose to listen to too often.

Anyway I'm glad they did record it and I like it. To be in the bottom third  of Dream Theaters discography is no mean feat as that means you are in the top third (at least) of all records I have.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

I suppose I'm in the minority on this one.

I understand the criticisms that ToT often gets, and I agree with most of them to a degree. But most of the Mangini era is too inconsistent for me, and often just isn't as compelling as what you get on tracks like Stream of Consciousness or In the Name of God. The album is both more consistently high-energy, but also not as one-note as it seems at first.

[Grappler]

Train of Thought   

[NoFred]

Train of Thought   

Given that it's going 30% in a 1v4 poll I think that's a pretty good showing.

DT has been my favorite band since I&W, but I definitely lean toward metal, and ToT did exactly what it set out to do.

[DoctorAction]

ToT is almost my least favourite DT (stylistic misfire like TA for me) and DoT is my current go-to DT so no contest afaic.

[lovethedrake]

Train of Thought is the last of the classic era DT albums IMO.   Although it is not a personal favorite, I still consider it to be an album by a band firing on all cylinders in their prime.   I listened to it yesterday and really enjoyed it, I lean more prog but as a metal album it's inspired and kicks you in the nuts (in a good way).

After that comes what I consider to be the Dark Ages of DT.    A time where the band seemed tired and lacked inspiration.  Labrie was starting to lose his vocals and was also being forced to sing in a more metal way and they started to lose their way.   While I enjoy stuff on Octavarium, SC, and BC&SL, I started to think DT was done in terms of producing magic.

Then ADTOE sort of bridges the gap between the Dark Ages of DT and a "return to form".     IMO ADTOE is the worst DT album but it got them back on track stylistically.

Now I consider DT to be in their "aging but still awesome age" A slightly poor man's version of classic era DT but still great.   Each album starting with DT has gotten better and better and DoT almost feels like it could have followed SDOIT. Also, for the first time since SDOIT they produced a song that can arguably be lumped into the "truly classic DT category" in AWE.   

Anyways,  thats my jumbled up mind spewing thoughts onto the computer

 

[Anxiety35]

I really enjoy Train of Thought. It's a specific album for DT as it's a straight up metal record and isn't standard DT fare. Not a bad thing at all. I'm a metal guy so TOT fits my palette.

Thant being said, I think Mangini era DT albums are better than TOT. Just my subjective opinion.