Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread

[Pebsie]

Testimony last night was superb. The brass and strings really add to the show and everyone was on top form. Great sound too. If you're on the fence about getting the single night ticket for Testimony 2... do it!!

[ronnibran]

New album out by Neal a couple days ago and zero people saying anything about it.  That speaks volumes lol.    In any case, the new album (Joseph pt 2) is good.  I'd say it's almost as good as part one.  Part one has a couple really good rockers on it, and this one has less of that and more story.  That's why I'm saying it's not quite as good.  That said, it still sounds "fresh" enough for what it is (a part 2 album).  I do enjoy all the special guests on this one, although I'd prefer a normal album (non story prog, just Neal singing).

I've accepted that Neal may never do albums I like as much as his "classic" albums (this is just my opinion, and I am considering classic to be Testimony through Testimony 2 and all albums between).

[Jamesman42]

I didn't know it came out. I have it added to Spotify now, but might have to wait until my roulette is over in a few weeks.

Any standout tracks?

[King Postwhore]

That's because it's religious music.

[Kwyjibo]

I know that this is out already but somehow amazon is not shipping my cd til end of January. Will listen to it then. The first one was good, so I'm hoping I will enjoy part 2 too.

[The Letter M]

That's because it's religious music.

Yep, just like Testimony 1 & 2, One, Sola Scriptura and Sola Gratia, Lifeline, The Similitude Of A Dream and The Great Adventure. And no one here talks about those albums either.

As for Joseph Pt. 2, I've had my signed copy for well over a week (Radiant shipped their copies super early), but I just haven't had time to listen to it yet.

-Marc.

[gzarruk]

New album out by Neal a couple days ago and zero people saying anything about it.  That speaks volumes lol.    In any case, the new album (Joseph pt 2) is good.  I'd say it's almost as good as part one.  Part one has a couple really good rockers on it, and this one has less of that and more story.  That's why I'm saying it's not quite as good.  That said, it still sounds "fresh" enough for what it is (a part 2 album).  I do enjoy all the special guests on this one, although I'd prefer a normal album (non story prog, just Neal singing).

I got it on release but haven't been able to listen to it in full yet. I really liked what I heard so far tho (about half of the album). I too would prefer something like his earlier stuff in approach, but I think quality-wise they are at the same level, we just might be a bit saturated/tired from NM stuff.

[ronnibran]

I didn't know it came out. I have it added to Spotify now, but might have to wait until my roulette is over in a few weeks.

Any standout tracks?

Standout tracks after just a few listens (for me, at least) would be Cosmic Mess and Freedom Road.

[Jamesman42]

I didn't know it came out. I have it added to Spotify now, but might have to wait until my roulette is over in a few weeks.

Any standout tracks?

Standout tracks after just a few listens (for me, at least) would be Cosmic Mess and Freedom Road.

Thank you! I am going to throw them in my roulette playlist for this week to sneak some listens in for those 2.

[OpenYourEyes311]

For me, Neal's biggest strength has become his weakness. He's so prolific that I've just started to be overwhelmed with all the new music. After Sola Gratia was "meh" for me, on top of the latest TA and NMB albums being just pretty good (as opposed to amazing like their previous efforts), I haven't been keeping up. I'll wait for the next collab with MP.

[bluefox4000]

I just don't know if neal has as much of a gift for melody left. or i should say memorable melody. Like nothing from any of his new label era (the frontiers albums i mean) has stuck with me as being particularly memorable.

or maybe i've moved on

[ProfessorPeart]

That's because it's religious music.

Yep, just like Testimony 1 & 2, One, Sola Scriptura and Sola Gratia, Lifeline, The Similitude Of A Dream and The Great Adventure. And no one here talks about those albums either.

As for Joseph Pt. 2, I've had my signed copy for well over a week (Radiant shipped their copies super early), but I just haven't had time to listen to it yet.

-Marc.

I think the issue is these last few seem to more of the 'in your face' variety of Neal's religious music. For me, when I see Randy and MP aren't involved in a Neal project I immediately assume it is more of the preachy/gospel variety than the other albums you named.

Full disclosure, I skipped that Exorcist thing and both these Joseph albums for the same reason. It seems this is the road Neal is going down now. MP even lightly hinted in his post about the UK Morsefest that this seems it might be the last he works with Neal for some time (my take).

[ronnibran]

That's because it's religious music.

Yep, just like Testimony 1 & 2, One, Sola Scriptura and Sola Gratia, Lifeline, The Similitude Of A Dream and The Great Adventure. And no one here talks about those albums either.

As for Joseph Pt. 2, I've had my signed copy for well over a week (Radiant shipped their copies super early), but I just haven't had time to listen to it yet.

-Marc.

I think the issue is these last few seem to more of the 'in your face' variety of Neal's religious music. For me, when I see Randy and MP aren't involved in a Neal project I immediately assume it is more of the preachy/gospel variety than the other albums you named.

Full disclosure, I skipped that Exorcist thing and both these Joseph albums for the same reason. It seems this is the road Neal is going down now. MP even lightly hinted in his post about the UK Morsefest that this seems it might be the last he works with Neal for some time (my take).

I'm pretty sure Mike also mentioned, in Dream Theater related interviews, that all his "other bands" are taking a back seat the next couple years as his main (maybe only) focus will be Dream Theater.  So I doubt it really has anything to do with Neal Morse or what Neal is writing. 

Maybe Neal Morse Band will be more of a "once in a great while" thing like Transatlantic has been. Kind of a bummer because I've really liked their output more than Neal Morse solo over the past ten years.  But oh well, definately not complaining, just mentioning my preferences.

[Pebsie]

When has Neal's music not been "in your face" about his faith?

* Testimony - Pretty obvious
* One - About as preachy as you can get
* Question Mark - Literally about the tabernacle in the wilderness
* Sola Scriptura - By scripture alone
* Lifeline - The JESUS IS MY LIFELINE album???
* Testimony 2 - Also very clear
* Momentum - I guess this one is a bit more subtle, but it's also one of the weaker solo albums (imo)

So that whole period of music from leaving Spock's to forming NMB is explicitly Christian. Everything except Momentum is entirely rooted in his beliefs. As for NMB...

* The Grand Experiment - I guess this is more subtle, but it still doesn't hold back. "Lke the air surrounds the earth / I'm engulfed in who you are" "The king of angel armies has come to bring the dead life and quench the darkness with the light"
* Similitude / Great Adventure - Based on Pilgrim's Progress and so while never explicity lyrically are inseperable from Christianity. That's what the story is about.
* Innocence & Danger - Also a more subtle one. Actually I can't summon a single line from this that is explicitly christian which feels weird.

Even in Transatlantic we've got "Bridge Across Forever", "Stranger In Your Soul" and then multiple references in TAU and TW and in the tracks on Kaleidoscope.

Anyway my point is that while I can understand people being put off by the recent focus on Biblical stories in his solo works it isn't anything new. He's spent the last 23 years making music like this with God being the not-so-subtle focus in all of his works. He's built a career off of making music like this and established a non-secular audience.

Maybe it doesn't bother me because I am a believer, but if I wasn't I think I'd want him to keep pursuing what he's passionate about and get to witness how sincerely emotional he is during shows. I don't think any lack of conversation around the new albums can be put down to their focus on the bible. And tbh I think the less God-centred albums are worse off for it.

[SomeoneLikeHim]

Maybe it doesn't bother me because I am a believer, but if I wasn't I think I'd want him to keep pursuing what he's passionate about and get to witness how sincerely emotional he is during shows. I don't think any lack of conversation around the new albums can be put down to their focus on the bible. And tbh I think the less God-centred albums are worse off for it.

This is actually pretty much exactly how I feel as a non-believer. It actually surprised me at first how I didn't really have an issue with the overt christianity of Neals music. The redeeming factor of it for me is how genuine and passionate Neal comes across when he's writing and singing about these topics.

I will say that the recent output (Sola Gratia onwards) has not been his best and I haven't revisited any of them too often. But I don't think religion is to blame (for this  ).

[DTA]

I can only listen to the same album so many times. The production, instrumentation, calling every opening track Overture, etc.- it all feels like I've heard it all before already. With the limited amount of time I listen to music, I'd rather spend it on new stuff that excites me.

[goo-goo]

I can only listen to the same album so many times. The production, instrumentation, calling every opening track Overture, etc.- it all feels like I've heard it all before already. With the limited amount of time I listen to music, I'd rather spend it on new stuff that excites me.

This is why I jumped off the NM train a few years ago (I only check out Transatlantic from anything Neal related).

On another note, I don't think Neal will stop writing/touring without MP. There's a few ways that can be addressed:
-MP present/playing parts in the writing sessions/recording portion and a touring drummer
-No MP with Eric taking over drums during writing sessions and a touring drummer.
-Writing/touring as Neal Morse only with other musicians involved (including or not including Eric, Randy, and Bill).

[Stadler]

The "religious" critique of Neal's work always sort of amused me, and, to me, spoke more of the listener than of Neal.

So many of us listen to music all the time about killing, and fucking, and doing drugs and the devil, or, as in the case of Jon Anderson and Ronnie Dio, just plain gibberish... and it's no big deal. 

I'm not a believer in the sense that Neal is, but I can listen to his work and take something from it just as I can from Iron Maiden or Kiss or whoever. "Supernatural"?   I'm pretty sure that's self-evident as to what it's about, but for me, it's just about love.   Don't we do that all the time with art?

[gzarruk]

When has Neal's music not been "in your face" about his faith?

* Testimony - Pretty obvious
* One - About as preachy as you can get
* Question Mark - Literally about the tabernacle in the wilderness
* Sola Scriptura - By scripture alone
* Lifeline - The JESUS IS MY LIFELINE album???
* Testimony 2 - Also very clear
* Momentum - I guess this one is a bit more subtle, but it's also one of the weaker solo albums (imo)

So that whole period of music from leaving Spock's to forming NMB is explicitly Christian. Everything except Momentum is entirely rooted in his beliefs. As for NMB...

* The Grand Experiment - I guess this is more subtle, but it still doesn't hold back. "Lke the air surrounds the earth / I'm engulfed in who you are" "The king of angel armies has come to bring the dead life and quench the darkness with the light"
* Similitude / Great Adventure - Based on Pilgrim's Progress and so while never explicity lyrically are inseperable from Christianity. That's what the story is about.
* Innocence & Danger - Also a more subtle one. Actually I can't summon a single line from this that is explicitly christian which feels weird.

Even in Transatlantic we've got "Bridge Across Forever", "Stranger In Your Soul" and then multiple references in TAU and TW and in the tracks on Kaleidoscope.

Anyway my point is that while I can understand people being put off by the recent focus on Biblical stories in his solo works it isn't anything new. He's spent the last 23 years making music like this with God being the not-so-subtle focus in all of his works. He's built a career off of making music like this and established a non-secular audience.

Maybe it doesn't bother me because I am a believer, but if I wasn't I think I'd want him to keep pursuing what he's passionate about and get to witness how sincerely emotional he is during shows. I don't think any lack of conversation around the new albums can be put down to their focus on the bible. And tbh I think the less God-centred albums are worse off for it.

That's a great post

[bluefox4000]

To me as an atheist the god aspect has never and still doesn't bother me.  it's he's just not.....at least in his last 3 albums.....musically interesting anymore.  the hooks are weaker.  Neal's Voice is very much showing it's wear and tear (not his fault it happens) and i'm beginning to really believe Neal is just not good as a solo guy.  Like IMO this man needs a band and collaborators with him.

Just my opinion.

[HOF]

I'm on the "Christian so the religious lyrics themselves don't bother me,* but the music isn't very interesting anymore" end of the spectrum. I loved Neal's early work in SB and Transatlantic. Flying Colors is good for the most part. I enjoy his more singer/songwriter oriented stuff, and I love what he's doing in DMJ. His solo prog and NMB stuff still has flashes of brilliance here and there, but I think he's made so much music in that vein now that he's sort of diluted his own brand to the point where it's all a bit interchangeable and just not very interesting. I think Roine Stolt has sort of hit a similar wall with The Flower Kings. Keeps releasing album after album that doesn't really connect in a deep way but hits most of the notes you'd expect from TFK. But Neal's music became stale for me fairly early on in his solo prog career.

*singing about Jesus or Christian themes/messages doesn't bother me, but I do think a lot of Neal's Christian lyrics lack a bit of artfulness that can make them a bit too cheesy for my personal tastes. I don't think it's particularly easy to marry the sacred with a largely secular art form without it coming off a bit hokey. Some have done well it for sure, and prog in general should afford some opportunities to do it well, but it's hard and I bristle a bit sometimes when those two don't seem to line up very well.

[Jamesman42]

Testimony through SS are Neal's height. I also loved Lifeline mostly, but I wouldn't include it. The 4 aforementioned albums are kinda like DT's run from SFAM-8VM (I don't like SFAM but I acknowledge its importance and popularity).

Both eras show each band in their best zone as more modern writers (compared to Spock's Beard and Kevin Moore days, respectively), writing memorable song after song while exploring slightly different versions of themselves. The albums the come after seem to not have as much backing, while still having a good amount of fans.

[hefdaddy42]

For me, the music Neal after Testimony (which was essentially his story) were religious albums about specific stories or themes about which he cared deeply, and it showed in the quality of the compositions.

What his last couple of solo albums sound like TO ME is that he felt like he needed to still be doing Christian projects, and went looking for stories/themes he could work with, but maybe wasn't quite so passionate about.  I don't know, that's how the last several sound to me, including the new one.  The playing and singing is as good as ever, but the writing just seems forced or just a couple of notches below.

I could, of course, be completely wrong, and I doubt it's the kind of thing that could even be verified, because why would he confirm such a theory?  Just telling you how it feels to me.

[Jamesman42]

I didn't know it came out. I have it added to Spotify now, but might have to wait until my roulette is over in a few weeks.

Any standout tracks?

Standout tracks after just a few listens (for me, at least) would be Cosmic Mess and Freedom Road.

Thank you! I am going to throw them in my roulette playlist for this week to sneak some listens in for those 2.

Cosmic Mess is really cool. The other one might grow, but for now that's where I am at.

Songs with Cosmic in the title = formula for success.

[ronnibran]

I've listened to the album a bit more in the past few days.  It's been growing on me.  I think I like it better than part one now.  What really turned the tide was the last couple of songs.  "Everlasting" is a really nice upbeat song that kinda reminds me (in its vibe, at least) of "Reunion" from the One album.  And then the album closer, Dawn of a New Day/God Uses Everything for Good is just so good.  I listened to that one over and over today.  It gives me "the feels".

I still don't rank this up with his "classic" era, but I definitely like the Joseph album(s) more than his last couple of solo albums.  Sola Gratia never really clicked with me.  And The Exorcist is nice but not something I would listen to often. 

[Herrick]

The "religious" critique of Neal's work always sort of amused me, and, to me, spoke more of the listener than of Neal.

So many of us listen to music all the time about killing, and fucking, and doing drugs and the devil, or, as in the case of Jon Anderson and Ronnie Dio, just plain gibberish... and it's no big deal. 

I'm not a believer in the sense that Neal is, but I can listen to his work and take something from it just as I can from Iron Maiden or Kiss or whoever. "Supernatural"?   I'm pretty sure that's self-evident as to what it's about, but for me, it's just about love.   Don't we do that all the time with art?

If any musician wrote album after album about how they genuinely enjoy killing people, then I'd be turned off by that. Wouldn't you? However, I'm down with fucking and doing drugs. Devil worship is just funny to me so I wouldn't have a problem with lyrics about that.

I used to avoid Neal Morse stuff because of the lyrics but I enjoy Transatlatic's The Whirlwind a lot and I didn't really notice anything too overt. Then again, I don't pay attention to the lyrics. I should really check out Morse's other stuff. One of these days.

[Jamesman42]

The "religious" critique of Neal's work always sort of amused me, and, to me, spoke more of the listener than of Neal.

So many of us listen to music all the time about killing, and fucking, and doing drugs and the devil, or, as in the case of Jon Anderson and Ronnie Dio, just plain gibberish... and it's no big deal. 

I'm not a believer in the sense that Neal is, but I can listen to his work and take something from it just as I can from Iron Maiden or Kiss or whoever. "Supernatural"?   I'm pretty sure that's self-evident as to what it's about, but for me, it's just about love.   Don't we do that all the time with art?

If any musician wrote album after album about how they genuinely enjoy killing people, then I'd be turned off by that. Wouldn't you? However, I'm down with fucking and doing drugs. Devil worship is just funny to me so I wouldn't have a problem with lyrics about that.

I used to avoid Neal Morse stuff because of the lyrics but I enjoy Transatlatic's The Whirlwind a lot and I didn't really notice anything too overt. Then again, I don't pay attention to the lyrics. I should really check out Morse's other stuff. One of these days.

? is the best album.


So I looked up Neal on Spotify, he has some older songs on there. https://open.spotify.com/album/3l1lE7rKIlNHREcm4RT75R?si=i2R0n4J8SFGZOmK9-dkiOg

Probably old news as it was released in 2019, but seeing some great songs like Author of Confusion, Lifeline, and The Land of Beginning Again is sweet for not having those full albums on there.

[The Letter M]

Neal just posted on Facebook:

Had a great jam session yesterday with Phil Keaggy, Byron House, and Chester Thompson! Was loads of fun and a lot of really great music and ideas were pouring out. What's next? We will see...

https://www.facebook.com/100044525675682/posts/pfbid03XRCY3J62pV45gr27VcyH3J4T9KCSbsxzVETpa3GUcySMxNHAGvgmj9gJG9gd4Bhl/?mibextid=Nif5oz

Hmmmmmmm...

-Marc.

[ReaperKK]

I'm only familiar with Phil, and I've heard of Chester but that seems like an interesting jam session. Had Neal ever worked with Phil?

[The Letter M]

I'm only familiar with Phil, and I've heard of Chester but that seems like an interesting jam session. Had Neal ever worked with Phil?

Yep, on Neal's One album. Phil is credited for the electric guitar solo in "The Creation" at 8:25, acoustic guitar solo in "The Man's Gone (Reprise)", and 2nd lead vocals on Cradle to the Grave.

-Marc.

[gzarruk]

Phil also played a solo on the Whirlwind medley from one of the Morsefests. 2015 maybe?

[HOF]

I wonder if this is going to be a jazz fusion type of thing. Neal has dabbled with that a little bit (he co-wrote a lot of Al's solo album which had a lot of that type of stuff, and Spock's did a live cover of Billy Cobham's Stratus back in the day).

[hefdaddy42]

Chester Thompson and Phil Keaggy are world class musicians.  If that turned into a real project, that would rock my face.

[Stadler]

I'd listen to that just for Chester. He's a beast.

[The Letter M]

I'd listen to that just for Chester. He's a beast.

He really is. His work on last year's Unitopia album is stellar!

-Marc.