Marillion

[HOF]

Special edition of This Strange Engine slated for November release with a September pre-order. I like the updated cover art.

https://www.facebook.com/100002220552278/posts/8245404178876852/?mibextid=rS40aB7S9Ucbxw6v

[romdrums]

I was at that Grand Rapids show that they're releasing with this! Nice!! 

[Stadler]

Dilemma:  Completist, so do I get it, or does the fact that I think This Strange Engine is one of the three least favorite Marillion albums control and I skip it?  I think it depends on the price; there is a live show in there.

[jammindude]

I've heard that take before from others and it always surprises me. I think TSE was the first Marillion album I heard that made me take notice of the band.

Man of a Thousand Faces, 80 Days, and the title track alone are worth it. I get that the rest is a mixed bag, but I feel that way about nearly all the Marillion albums.

[HOF]

TSE had three Marillion classics IMO: Man of a Thousand Faces, Estonia, and the title track.

The rest are average to below average Marillion tracks, and it's one of my less visited Marillion albums. But there is some good stuff there.

I probably like One Fine Day and Hope for the Future better than most Marillion fans do, and 80 Days is fine. Accidental Man and Memory of Water are two of the more forgettable Marillion songs.

[Stadler]

Estonia is BY FAR the highlight of that record. 

I was a Fish fan, first.  I loved, and still love, Seasons End.  HATED then, still sort of strongly dislike (though the remix is better) Holidays In Eden.  Really liked then (LOVE now) Brave, and really disliked (LOVE now) Afraid of Sunlight.  So when I heard TSE for the first time, it was LOVE, HATE, really liked, really disliked... then I HATED TSE.  At the time I stopped buying new Marilloin and chalked them up to a formerly great band that diverged from me with their new singer.  It happens, no hard feelings.  I didn't hear anything by them until Marbles, which I LOVED.   I subsequently went back and revisited... I like Anoraknophobia, like Radiation (though like the remix way better) and sort of can take or leave dot com.   Never warmed to TSE and Estonia is still the standout track on an otherwise drab album.

[SoundscapeMN]

I used to appreciate TSE a lot, but have found the songs to be pretty limited and not too adventurous. Even the title track I don't have the love for like many. I think it works better live though.

The bulk of the songs on TSE come across as almost saccharine 90's Pop.

Now, by comparison the records that followed it have aged like a fine wine.

[The Letter M]

I used to appreciate TSE a lot, but have found the songs to be pretty limited and not too adventurous. Even the title track I don't have the love for like many. I think it works better live though.

The bulk of the songs on TSE come across as almost saccharine 90's Pop.

Now, by comparison the records that followed it have aged like a fine wine.

I can see how that, and for me personally, "modern" Marillion begins around Anoraknophobia and Marbles. 90s Marillion always felt a bit hit-or-miss for me, and other than a couple albums, I rarely revisit this era of the band. On the other hand, 00s Marillion probably gets more play from me than any other, with the aforementioned two albums, as well as Happiness Is The Road. Then again, Marillion haven't been on any sort of regular rotation for me for well over 15 years, and I only come around to them when a new album is about to come out.

-Marc.

[Puppies_On_Acid]

Estonia is BY FAR the highlight of that record. 

I was a Fish fan, first.  I loved, and still love, Seasons End.  HATED then, still sort of strongly dislike (though the remix is better) Holidays In Eden.  Really liked then (LOVE now) Brave, and really disliked (LOVE now) Afraid of Sunlight.  So when I heard TSE for the first time, it was LOVE, HATE, really liked, really disliked... then I HATED TSE.  At the time I stopped buying new Marilloin and chalked them up to a formerly great band that diverged from me with their new singer.  It happens, no hard feelings.  I didn't hear anything by them until Marbles, which I LOVED.   I subsequently went back and revisited... I like Anoraknophobia, like Radiation (though like the remix way better) and sort of can take or leave dot com.   Never warmed to TSE and Estonia is still the standout track on an otherwise drab album.

Holidays In Eden is a strange one for me. The first track is amazing and feels like a perfect follow up to Season's End (the album). Then the rest of the album just kind of felt like (at first) was just there and nothing interesting really happens. I grew to really appreciate the more pop leaning songs the more I listened to it, but it was an album I had put on the back burner for so many years.

Somewhere Else was also like that for me. I always thought it sounded like a bunch of Marbles B-sides, but that album also grew on me. There's just something so endearing about both of those albums.

For my money, I think Happiness Is the Road is my least favorite Marillion album up to this point. I think if it was whittled down to a single cd's worth of material it would have been a much more consistent album, since there are good songs there.

[romdrums]

I had originally purchased the US version of Holidays in Eden in 1993, and the tracklisting was quite a bit different from the UK release. It went:

Cover My Eyes
No One Can
Splintering Heart
The Party
A Collection
Holidays in Eden
How Can It Hurt
Dry Land
Waiting to Happen
This Town
The Rakes Progress
100 Nights

That's the version I was familiar with. So they hit with the two singles up front, and then the album pivoted to the darker, proggier stuff. I always felt it worked better that way.

[Stadler]

Holidays In Eden is a strange one for me. The first track is amazing and feels like a perfect follow up to Season's End (the album). Then the rest of the album just kind of felt like (at first) was just there and nothing interesting really happens. I grew to really appreciate the more pop leaning songs the more I listened to it, but it was an album I had put on the back burner for so many years.

Somewhere Else was also like that for me. I always thought it sounded like a bunch of Marbles B-sides, but that album also grew on me. There's just something so endearing about both of those albums.

For my money, I think Happiness Is the Road is my least favorite Marillion album up to this point. I think if it was whittled down to a single cd's worth of material it would have been a much more consistent album, since there are good songs there.

Ironically, it's not the 'poppiness' of HiE that bugs me.  I don't mind pop, at all.   I just thought it was a weak - I don't mean "weak" as in "I hate it", but "weak" as in "lacking power or punch" - record.  FOR ME, The King Of Sunset Town - despite me not having even a remote clue what it's about - grabbed me by the loins.   ...The Space gives me chills.  After Me is just... beautiful.  There's very little on HiE that grabs me like that, and in fact, there are moments like the part of Splintering Heart where H sings "From a splintering heart
And it tears her apart, but not as much as this..." and it's supposed to be this epic kick in to the band and it's just... lame.    It's also the first album where H starts to reveal his tendency to be a bit preachy, judge-y and sanctimonious, which is the part of H I like least.

[SoundscapeMN]

I dunno, I find songs like The Party and the closing suite of This Town The Rakes Progress and 100 Nights very engaging.

Also the Rare Bird cover of Sympathy is awesome. The keyboard riff that Mark Kelly uses one could call "punchy" or being pretty in your face.

[ytserush]

Dilemma:  Completist, so do I get it, or does the fact that I think This Strange Engine is one of the three least favorite Marillion albums control and I skip it?  I think it depends on the price; there is a live show in there.

I didn't get Brave. (But then I still have the first two releases of it) and that's my least favorite along with Less Is More (Which I doubt will be a deluxe edition so that won't be a problem.) I love This Strange Engine and I thought the show that tour was great even though the venue (Club Bene) wasn't. My guess it that the price will be like the rest of them.

It will be less than Vigil and Internal Exile which is now up for preorder. A bit pricey but but those two close out the reissue program (aside from a probable farewell tour live release and the book which are farther down the road. But those two releases have more bonus material than any previous reissue as he was still "backed" by a major label.

[ytserush]

TSE had three Marillion classics IMO: Man of a Thousand Faces, Estonia, and the title track.

The rest are average to below average Marillion tracks, and it's one of my less visited Marillion albums. But there is some good stuff there.

I probably like One Fine Day and Hope for the Future better than most Marillion fans do, and 80 Days is fine. Accidental Man and Memory of Water are two of the more forgettable Marillion songs.

Probably in the minority on this record but it's one of my favorites.Love the organic natural timbre of it. I think it's one of Hogarth's best efforts in the studio. I'd have given up Marillion if I didn't like this record after Brave and Afraid of Sunlight. Stopped being a completist after that.  Tour was great too. First time we saw them since the Los Trios Marillion Tour  for Six Of One Half Dozen Of The Other.

[Puppies_On_Acid]

Ironically, it's not the 'poppiness' of HiE that bugs me.  I don't mind pop, at all.   I just thought it was a weak - I don't mean "weak" as in "I hate it", but "weak" as in "lacking power or punch" - record.  FOR ME, The King Of Sunset Town - despite me not having even a remote clue what it's about - grabbed me by the loins.   ...The Space gives me chills.  After Me is just... beautiful.  There's very little on HiE that grabs me like that, and in fact, there are moments like the part of Splintering Heart where H sings "From a splintering heart
And it tears her apart, but not as much as this..." and it's supposed to be this epic kick in to the band and it's just... lame.    It's also the first album where H starts to reveal his tendency to be a bit preachy, judge-y and sanctimonious, which is the part of H I like least.

I love that kick in with the band in Splintering Heart! Tastes!.....as Chad likes to say.

But I get what you mean about most of the album lacking some punch.

[ytserush]

I love that kick in with the band in Splintering Heart! Tastes!.....as Chad likes to say.

But I get what you mean about most of the album lacking some punch.

Especially live!  But then every song on that album is better live.

[HOF]

I love that kick in with the band in Splintering Heart! Tastes!.....as Chad likes to say.

But I get what you mean about most of the album lacking some punch.

I actually don't think HIE lacks punch, it just has some songs without a lot of it. Splintering Heart definitely has it, Waiting to Happen has it, etc.

It's one of those albums that I've probably listened to as much as any other Marillion album. It's such a curiosity for me really. I think it works really well as a poppy prog album, but it's not really like anything else besides Marillion. I love it.

[Stadler]

I didn't get Brave. (But then I still have the first two releases of it) and that's my least favorite along with Less Is More (Which I doubt will be a deluxe edition so that won't be a problem.) I love This Strange Engine and I thought the show that tour was great even though the venue (Club Bene) wasn't. My guess it that the price will be like the rest of them.

It will be less than Vigil and Internal Exile which is now up for preorder. A bit pricey but but those two close out the reissue program (aside from a probable farewell tour live release and the book which are farther down the road. But those two releases have more bonus material than any previous reissue as he was still "backed" by a major label.

I bought both the Fish deluxes.   I worry that once he closes Chocolate Frog, that his catalogue is going to be EXORBITANT on eBay.  I've really warmed to the Fish catalogue in recent years.  Even stuff I hated like Suits has sort of wormed it's way into my brain.  The remix of 13th Star is friggin' amazing.  What a record (same with Feast of Consequences).

[ytserush]

I bought both the Fish deluxes.   I worry that once he closes Chocolate Frog, that his catalogue is going to be EXORBITANT on eBay.  I've really warmed to the Fish catalogue in recent years.  Even stuff I hated like Suits has sort of wormed it's way into my brain.  The remix of 13th Star is friggin' amazing.  What a record (same with Feast of Consequences).

Suits was never a favorite of mine but listening to the songs live really bring them to life. Even Field Of Crows sounds better live. Both of those still aren't favorites but I like them better than I did. Also, the remixes do add something  (Sometimes it's like listening to the albums again for the first time.) and if you don't like them you still have the originals. It's nice to have that option.

That's why I got Vigil and Exile. Who knows what's going to happen in the next six months or so. He mentioned yesterday that he hasn't heard from his daughter who was supposedly going to take over the mail order until it shuts down in a year. He doesn't want to be caught with inventory so there's not going to be a lot of restocking in the event of a sell out.

[ytserush]

Decent Steve Rothery guitar/rig/career interview. Fruity goodness. Really enjoy hearing/seeing this man play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-7JjVVfgSE

[BrickGlass]

Been listening to Marillion again for the last couple of weeks. I always work my way through a discography chronologically when listening to any band. I'm up to Sounds That Can't Be Made. If I'm being honest I feel like Gaza and Montreal are weak songs on that album. I usually love their longer tracks, but those two just fall flat for me a bit. Both have parts that I really love, but H's lyrics are a litte weak on those two tracks. He's just kind of telling a story on both tracks and not doing his usual great job in regards to cadence, phrasing and flow.

My top five albums of theirs remain:
1. Marbles
2. Brave
3. Afraid of Sunlight
4. Clutching at Straws
5. Misplace Childhood

They've got several other really great albums imo. Still a top 10 all-time band for me.

[HOF]

I love Montreal. I think there is some really great imagery there, and the way he basically turned his diary into a song is clever. Gaza I like as well but it always felt out of place on the album (it was written last after the album was pretty much done). I always feel like the album would be better without it and maybe they could have done a standalone single or an EP featuring Gaza.

[Stadler]

Been listening to Marillion again for the last couple of weeks. I always work my way through a discography chronologically when listening to any band. I'm up to Sounds That Can't Be Made. If I'm being honest I feel like Gaza and Montreal are weak songs on that album. I usually love their longer tracks, but those two just fall flat for me a bit. Both have parts that I really love, but H's lyrics are a litte weak on those two tracks. He's just kind of telling a story on both tracks and not doing his usual great job in regards to cadence, phrasing and flow.

My top five albums of theirs remain:
1. Marbles
2. Brave
3. Afraid of Sunlight
4. Clutching at Straws
5. Misplace Childhood

They've got several other really great albums imo. Still a top 10 all-time band for me.

Interesting... other that No. 1, which is an all-time top five for me (any band):

1. Clutching At Straws
2. Misplaced Childhood
3. Brave
4. Season's End
5. Marbles

Afraid of Sunlight is probably 6 or 7, with Fugazi the other one.

[Max Kuehnau]

I'd probably use your list as well, Stadler, but maybe in a different order (or maybe not), I never listened to Afraid Of Sunlight to date btw. (well familiar with Fugazi though)

[SoundscapeMN]

My top five albums of theirs remain:
1. Marbles
2. Brave
3. Afraid of Sunlight
4. Clutching at Straws
5. Misplace Childhood

these are often regarded as their 5 best/favorite. I rate all 5 of them at a perfect 5-stars.

My order tho

1. Brave
2. Clutching at Straws
3. Marbles
4. Misplaced Childhood
5. Afraid of Sunlight

[HOF]

We need a Marillion countdown thread!

Top 5 as of this moment without any thought:

1. Afraid of Sunlight
2. Brave
3. Marbles
4. Clutching at Straws
5. Marillion.com (ask me again on a different day and we'll see about this one. I do really love this one though).

[nick_z]

Interesting... other that No. 1, which is an all-time top five for me (any band):

1. Clutching At Straws
2. Misplaced Childhood
3. Brave
4. Season's End
5. Marbles

Afraid of Sunlight is probably 6 or 7, with Fugazi the other one.

We are not too different. I would go:

1. Clutching at Straws
2. Misplaced Childhood
3. Seasons End
4. Brave
5. Afraid of Sunlight

Although on certain days Holidays in Eden will protest its 5th spot...

[Puppies_On_Acid]

We are not too different. I would go:

1. Clutching at Straws
2. Misplaced Childhood
3. Seasons End
4. Brave
5. Afraid of Sunlight

Although on certain days Holidays in Eden will protest its 5th spot...

I don't see Marbles on your list......I don't even know who you are anymore!

My list would be

1. Marbles
2. Season's End
3. Clutching at Straws
4. Misplaced Childhood
5. Afraid of Sunlight or maybe Script for a Jester's Tear

[nick_z]

I don't see Marbles on your list......I don't even know who you are anymore!

[Stadler]

We are not too different. I would go:

1. Clutching at Straws
2. Misplaced Childhood
3. Seasons End
4. Brave
5. Afraid of Sunlight

Although on certain days Holidays in Eden will protest its 5th spot...

We are similar; though on that last one, HiE is nowhere near my top 10. 

[romdrums]

My top 5:

1a. Afraid of Sunlight
1b. Brave
3. Clutching at Straws
4. Marbles
5. Anoraknophobia

Seasons End has held the 5 spot in the past, as has Fugazi. Brave and AOS are basically tied at number 1 for me.

[nick_z]

We are similar; though on that last one, HiE is nowhere near my top 10. 

Yep, I know you are not a fan

You can definitely tell there are "forces" pulling in different directions on that one. But for some reason I'm very fond of it...

[HOF]

Yep, I know you are not a fan

You can definitely tell there are "forces" pulling in different directions on that one. But for some reason I'm very fond of it...

I like the tension there a lot actually. It's a bit of the band searching for a direction with Hogarth, but even with the more overt pop direction you still get Marillion shining through. I would consider it one of my candidates for the 5th spot as well.

[Stadler]

It's funny, it's not the typical things that ruin HiE for me. I don't mind "pop".  I don't mind "shorter songs".  "Dry Land" is a great fucking song.  Even "No One Can" is decent live; it's a great melody.   I just think as a group, overall, they're not great songs - "Cover My Eyes" is top 10 least favorite Marillion songs - and I think the strengths of the band - their instrumentation - is lacking.  I always cite "Splintering Heart"; you've got this big build up, and then the "From a splintering heart, and it tears her apart, but not as much as this!" line and I'm expecting something momentous, like the start of Slainté Mhath, and...  pffft.   It's just not powerful for me. It's the same criticism I have of that Neil Peart drum fill in Red Sector A.  Pffft. 

I know this is a me-thing, but I also am not thrilled with the lyrics on that record.  That's Hogarth at his most navel-gazing, and that's my least favorite Hogarth.  I will say, Side 2 (of the UK version) is head and shoulders above Side 1.

[HOF]

It's funny, it's not the typical things that ruin HiE for me. I don't mind "pop".  I don't mind "shorter songs".  "Dry Land" is a great fucking song.  Even "No One Can" is decent live; it's a great melody.   I just think as a group, overall, they're not great songs - "Cover My Eyes" is top 10 least favorite Marillion songs - and I think the strengths of the band - their instrumentation - is lacking.  I always cite "Splintering Heart"; you've got this big build up, and then the "From a splintering heart, and it tears her apart, but not as much as this!" line and I'm expecting something momentous, like the start of Slainté Mhath, and...  pffft.   It's just not powerful for me. It's the same criticism I have of that Neil Peart drum fill in Red Sector A.  Pffft. 

I know this is a me-thing, but I also am not thrilled with the lyrics on that record.  That's Hogarth at his most navel-gazing, and that's my least favorite Hogarth.  I will say, Side 2 (of the UK version) is head and shoulders above Side 1.

Cover My Eyes and Splintering Heart are good examples of producer-crafted songs a band would never come up with on their own, and I think that can be really important to a band's development. Cover My Eyes was the first song to hook me from this album. That's just a great pop rock song, way too simple for Marillion to write on their own. And Splintering Heart, the whole intro was so un-Marillion (the demo version just starts out rocky like the middle section). But then that middle part does sound like classic Marillion to me. There's the big explosion that quiets down into the atmospheric bit and then it explodes again into the solo. That is classic Marillion to me.

As for the lyrics, I don't know, I just think these are fairly excellent. This Town and 100 Nights especially are just tremendous. The Party is also I think a strong piece of writing. But you also have some really great lines on Waiting to Happen, Splintering Heart, and I think Dry Land is great too. Cover My Eyes is a dumb song about girls, and No One Can is clunky (and the title Track was Helmet), but there's more good stuff than bad here lyrically for me.

Holidays in Eden is mostly one of those albums I've wrestled with a lot. I didn't like it much at first. It grew on me over time, and I think a lot of that has been just trying to figure out what the album is about. It's just Marillion doing Marillion things ultimately, and I think I can see that better now than I could when I first got it (having limited knowledge of their music at the time).