Fam, I am just all torn up inside over this one..

https://www.npr.org/2024/10/04/nx-s1-5139950/garth-brooks-sexual-assault-accusation-lawsuit

I remember dad playing his music in the den and mom and brother dancing around to "Friends in Low Places" every Christmas before the accident. It's killing me to see that Good 'ol Garth was just a predator the entire time. I feel like my childhood has been ripped from me... trying to smile now...

The article seems to paint a very "he said she said" picture. And considering it went on for years, this really seems like a consensual affair that turned ugly. The guy is still a turd for cheating on Trish, but I defer to Bill Burr.

"Believe ALL women. REALLY? No middle ground at all? What about the psychos?"

IDK who Bill Burr is but I don't think I agree with that quote

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 05, 2024, 09:13:05 AMIDK who Bill Burr is but I don't think I agree with that quote

Why?

BTW, my first inclination is that these allegations are bullshit, but we'll see. 

This sums it up:

https://youtu.be/lW2pXu97Yvo?t=203

To be fair, he is giving you 87 percent.

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 05, 2024, 09:13:05 AMIDK who Bill Burr is but I don't think I agree with that quote

Here's the famous clip from his stand up. He is one of the most popular comedians of the last 20+ years.

https://youtube.com/shorts/tdx-L7ICD-8?si=zdrYea9bfm41aEiR

The line that gets me is when he mocks people who say, "You can't make that stuff up!"

I've personally known women who have made stuff up...and even later admitted that they did it for the sole reason that they hated the guy and wanted to destroy their lives. 

More than one. Seriously.

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 04, 2024, 04:05:51 PMIt's killing me to see that Good 'ol Garth was just a predator the entire time. I feel like my childhood has been ripped from me... trying to smile now...

So...we should just accept the allegation as true without any evidence having been offered or the case going to trial?  Has this country really come to that point? 

Quote from: pg1067 on October 05, 2024, 03:35:17 PMSo...we should just accept the allegation as true without any evidence having been offered or the case going to trial?  Has this country really come to that point? 

YOU'RE PART OF THE PROBLEM!!!

Quote from: pg1067 on October 05, 2024, 03:35:17 PMSo...we should just accept the allegation as true without any evidence having been offered or the case going to trial?  

Fuck no

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 05, 2024, 09:13:05 AMIDK who Bill Burr is but I don't think I agree with that quote

Are you serious?  You automatically believe anything that any woman says, no question?  It's not even possible that she's lying or crazy, and the guy has no say?

What do you expect from a guy who's proud of the fact he's got friends in low places?

What if it wasn't Garth Brooks, though? What if it was Chris Gaines?

Quote from: romdrums on October 07, 2024, 06:24:10 AMWhat if it wasn't Garth Brooks, though? What if it was Chris Gaines?

 

Quote from: Orbert on October 06, 2024, 05:17:54 PMAre you serious?  You automatically believe anything that any woman says, no question?  It's not even possible that she's lying or crazy, and the guy has no say?

I don't think I said that either

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 07, 2024, 07:22:08 AMI don't think I said that either

You don't know who Bill Burr is but you do know who Darth Brooks is?!

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 07, 2024, 07:22:08 AMI don't think I said that either

Then what are you saying?

Burr said that it doesn't make sense to just believe all women.  You said you don't agree.  The obvious conclusion is that you think we should just believe all women.  You've already condemned Garth Brooks as a "predator" based on the allegations of one person.

Quote from: Zantera on October 07, 2024, 07:39:10 AMYou don't know who Bill Burr is but you do know who Darth Brooks is?!

Nope, he seems like the sleazy guy from Breaking Bad though, the one Saul Goodman is always hiring with Huell to do nefarious deeds

Quote from: Orbert on October 07, 2024, 07:39:36 AMThen what are you saying?

Allegations should be taken seriously, is what I am saying. Unsure what's so tough to understand about that. Of course they should be investigated, evidence considered, etc. These aren't just random allegations on a facebook post, it's a trial with clear allegations, and we will see what comes of it

EDIT: Additionally, there is no debate over whether he was unfaithful with his wife with his hair stylist. That alone should show that his honesty and credibility here are up for question? I don't really see why everyone is jumping to defend him. The best case scenario here is that he is a liar and a cheater

I'd say it's OK to listen to Garth just like you did before the accident.
I don't think the allegations are true. Seems pretty straightforward to me; he had a wifey for many years (his wife's stylist) who got upset she was never going to graduate to the Queen.

Quote from: Wukong on October 07, 2024, 07:44:52 AMI'd say it's OK to listen to Garth just like you did before the accident.

Thanks for the reassurance. I hope I can without thinking back

Not a Garth Brooks fan, but if we can't listen to bands with members who mistreated women, that rules out just about every 80's metal band.

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 07, 2024, 07:22:08 AMI don't think I said that either

Here's what you did say (this is a word-for-word quote from your original post):  "Garth was just a predator the entire time."  You based this not on any actual facts.  Not on a conviction in a criminal action or a finding of liability in a civil action.  Rather, you based this solely on the fact that someone made allegations.  Therefore, you apparently believe that we should just accept the allegations as true without any evidence having been offered or the case going to trial.

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 07, 2024, 07:43:45 AMAllegations should be taken seriously, is what I am saying. Unsure what's so tough to understand about that. Of course they should be investigated, evidence considered, etc. These aren't just random allegations on a facebook post, it's a trial with clear allegations, and we will see what comes of it

EDIT: Additionally, there is no debate over whether he was unfaithful with his wife with his hair stylist. That alone should show that his honesty and credibility here are up for question? I don't really see why everyone is jumping to defend him. The best case scenario here is that he is a liar and a cheater

I haven't read every article on this, but of the ones I've read I didn't see anything that put ANYTHING "beyond debate".  I certainly didn't read anything that said he was absolutely banging the hairstylist. 

And even if he was, if he was banging someone on the side, that's between him and Trisha and the woman he was banging.  You know nothing, Jon Snow.  That's not in and of itself sexual assault, or being a "predator".

I'm certainly not "defending him" from whatever actions he did. (It sounds to me like he had a consensual side affair which went south...and IF that is the case then I agree he is guilty of cheating on his wife and that's horrible)

But I don't think it's proper to start throwing terms like "predator" around with zero evidence to that effect.

I'm not passing any judgment, I'm just wondering if she had anything to do with this:

He should counter sue for that haircut for sure!

Quote from: pg1067 on October 07, 2024, 08:21:37 AMHere's what you did say (this is a word-for-word quote from your original post):  "Garth was just a predator the entire time."  You based this not on any actual facts.  Not on a conviction in a criminal action or a finding of liability in a civil action.  Rather, you based this solely on the fact that someone made allegations.  Therefore, you apparently believe that we should just accept the allegations as true without any evidence having been offered or the case going to trial.

This is fair. I was definitely up in my feelings when I posted this and after examining the further things that have come to light I am glad to report I may have been wrong about this. Sorry if my quick-to-emotions post upset anyone here who loves Garth as much as I do.

I know this might sound strange, but after listening to the new Dream Theater single, it really got me thinking about the recent Garth Brooks situation with the sexual assault allegations. I know, it's a bit of a leap from progressive metal to country star controversies, but hear me out. So, I was blasting the new single on repeat (I won't spoil anything for those waiting for the album), and what really hit me was how layered and nuanced the song was—not just musically, but thematically. It made me think about how things aren't always as they seem on the surface, and how quick we can be to make judgments before we have the full picture. Dream Theater has always had this ability to craft these intricate stories where you have to peel back layers to really understand the message, and that got me reflecting on the Garth Brooks situation in a deeper way. When the allegations first came out, I remember thinking, "Wow, that's messed up," and, like a lot of people, I was quick to draw conclusions based on the headlines. But after listening to this DT track, which deals with themes of perception, truth, and self-reflection (typical DT, right?), I found myself questioning how we often react to news like this. I'm not saying Garth is innocent or guilty—none of us really know what went down. But the song made me realize that it's important to take a step back and consider that maybe there's more to the story, more context we don't have. In today's world, it's so easy to get caught up in the outrage machine, but this song just reminded me that sometimes there are layers to situations that we don't immediately see. Maybe this doesn't change how I feel about the seriousness of the allegations, but it does make me think more critically about how we process these things as a society. I don't know if anyone else gets this kind of reaction from DT's music, but for me, it was one of those moments where the music connected to something real-world and made me reflect. Dream Theater has always had that ability to get me thinking beyond the immediate, and this single just happened to push me in that direction.

Quote from: romdrums on October 07, 2024, 01:38:26 PMI'm not passing any judgment, I'm just wondering if she had anything to do with this:

LOL!!!  Good ole Chris Gaines. 

My GF (now wife) drug me to a Garth Brooks show back in 2016.  She is a huge country music fan.  He has a couple of good tunes, but overall, not my cup of tea at all.  He was a hell of an entertainer on stage though.  You could see some Freddie Mercury / David Lee Roth in his act.  It was entertaining to watch, even if the music ain't my thing.

Hopefully, the allegations aren't true.  I'll withhold judgment if/until we get more information.

I've seen him twice; excellent show both times (and both times he had a spot where it was just him and a guitar, and 16,000 of us.  He kept that audience rapt both times, no small feat.)

Quote from: Stadler on October 11, 2024, 11:34:55 AMHe kept that audience rapt both times,

How do you pronounce that? 

Quote"Believe ALL women. REALLY? No middle ground at all? What about the psychos?"

This is absolutely correct. Moreover, it needs to be kept in mind that the psychos are contributing greatly to the problem by making it harder to believe the real victims.

Quote from: TheHoveringSojourn808 on October 07, 2024, 07:43:45 AMAllegations should be taken seriously, is what I am saying.

This is also absolutely correct. Even allegations from the psychos. There's a lot of space between taking something seriously and believing it, though.

Quote from: Wukong on October 07, 2024, 07:44:52 AMI don't think the allegations are true. Seems pretty straightforward to me; he had a wifey for many years (his wife's stylist) who got upset she was never going to graduate to the Queen.

I wouldn't be making assumptions about his side, either. That seems to me a failure to take it seriously. That also contributes to the problem.

Quote from: Adami on October 07, 2024, 07:48:23 AMNot a Garth Brooks fan, but if we can't listen to bands with members who mistreated women, that rules out just about every 80's metal band.

Only using only the most modern and all-encompassing definition of mistreatment we can craft.

Quote from: TAC on October 11, 2024, 02:15:42 PMHow do you pronounce that? 

Rhymes with tapped.

Quote from: El Barto on October 11, 2024, 04:40:37 PMRhymes with tapped.

Just making sure it's not taped.

Anyone have an update on this?

Quote from: Wukong on October 14, 2024, 10:51:26 AMAnyone have an update on this?

Here is a condensed timeline of important events based on my research

1999: Jane Roe begins working for Trisha Yearwood. Per Jane Roe's lawsuit, she was hired to do makeup and hair styling for Trisha Yearwood for the first time in 1999. Over the years she continued to work for Yearwood and other celebrities.

Oct. 2000: Garth Brooks files for divorce from Sandy Mahl. Their divorce was finalized in 2001.

Dec. 10, 2005: Garth Brooks marries Trisha Yearwood. The couple got married seven months after becoming engaged.

2005: Garth Brooks says Jane Roe began working for him. This may end up being an inconsequential discrepancy, but in his Sept. 13 filing, Garth Brooks said he first hired Jane Roe in 2005. But she says ...

2017: Jane Roe says she began working for Garth Brooks... she first started to work with Brooks in 2017.

Early 2019: Jane Roe says Garth Brooks sexually assaulted her for the first time. According to Jane Roe's court filing, Brooks began to hire her more frequently in 2018, after learning of her financial difficulties. Her first described incident of sexual assault came in early 2019. Roe says she was at Brooks' home when he walked out of the shower naked, grabbed her hands and forced them onto his genitals while using sexual language.

May 2019: Jane Roe says Garth Brooks raped her. This photo of Brooks and Yearwood with Sam Moore is from an earlier date, but relevant because his accuser says Brooks had flown her to L.A. to do his makeup and hair for a Sam Moore tribute concert when he raped her in the hotel. Only she and Brooks were on the private plane to California, she says, and she furthers that the hotel room had just one bedroom. Her lawsuit describes a violent rape in detail, as well as injuries she sustained.

Oct. 2019: Jane Roe says she escaped a second rape attempt in L.A. Five months later, Brooks allegedly brought Roe to L.A. again. When she entered his room to do his hair and makeup, she claims he made it clear he wanted to repeat what had happened in May. The filing notes that, "Ms. Roe managed to escape the situation because he was running late and people were waiting to pick him up."

Early 2020: Jane Roe says Garth Brooks deleted sexually suggestive messages from her phone. Jane Roe refers to, and seemingly quotes, messages and conversations between her and Brooks throughout the 9,000 word lawsuit. She states that in 2020, he grabbed her phone and deleted sexual messages he'd sent. She also says he emailed her using many different names and addresses. Brooks' wife and manager were said to be present for some of the more vulgar conversations and suggestions, per Roe.

May 2020: Garth Brooks says Jane Roe moved to Mississippi, ending her employment. This is another discrepancy in the timelines between plaintiff and defendant.

2021: Jane Roe says she moved to Mississippi, ending employment. She says she moved in May 2021 and describes several conversations she had with Brooks about ending her employment. Her depiction of Brooks in these conversations is of a man who was sad that she was leaving.

July 17, 2024: Garth Brooks receives letter from Jane Roe's lawyers. Per Brooks' Sept. 13 complaint, the letter alleged a "litany of sexual misconduct by Plaintiff," including grooming, unwanted sexual touching and sexual assault. "Defendant also alleged a belief that Plaintiff planned to hire someone to murder her." This was the first time Brooks had learned of the charges, he says.

Aug. 23, 2024: Garth Brooks receives second letter from Jane Roe's lawyers. A second letter offered to refrain from filing the lawsuit in exchange for a multi-million dollar payment, Brooks says.

Sept. 13, 2024: Garth Brooks files complaint in Mississippi Federal Court. Knowing Jane Roe would file, Brooks filed a complaint in Mississippi under pseudonyms John Doe and Jane Doe. His hope was to get a court to rule that all future proceedings would use these names and he would not be publicly identified.

Oct. 3, 2024: Jane Roe files lawsuit in California. Jane Roe's lawsuit in California came after Brooks filed in Mississippi, but before that court ruled. In it, she named him as Garth Brooks. His attorneys would later say CNN knew about the case before it was fully filed.

Oct. 7, 2024: Garth Brooks acknowledges lawsuit. Brooks actually had a concert on Oct. 3, the day the lawsuit became public. He referred to it in a message post-show, but fully acknowledged the lawsuit four days later during his weekly Inside Studio G livestream. "This thing is on. It's gonna happen," he said, telling fans: "People are telling me it could be up to two years." "So my suggestion is, we all take a deep breath, just kinda settle in and let's hold hands and take a trip together, because it is something that we cannot talk about. That's all we can say about it."

Oct. 8, 2024: Garth Brooks names his accuser. The next day, Brooks amended his Sept. 13 filing, now using his full name and Jane Roe's full name. I have chosen to not identify his accuser at this time.