I thought I'd create this since it hasn't yet.

One of the things I like most about this song is the subject matter of a shadow man or shadow people.

When I was a kid I saw these beings/illusions, or whatever they are, all the time.  Most of the time they would come from the darkest corner in my bedroom by my closet.  They would then move up to the side of my bed and just stand there.

Once I dreamed that several were in my room and they picked me up and started tossing me between them.

Another time I saw 3-5 of them at the foot of my bed walking around in a circle.

They were almost always featureless and as tall as the ceiling.  But at times they were half size.

Anyway this song brought those memories right back to the surface of my brain.


Musically, I love all the great riffs, especially the intro riff.  That has got to be one of the best riffs JP has ever written imo.  I love how it resolves.

The chorus is amazing like others have said in other threads.  Cool nods to their past works like The Astonishing, Metropolis part 2 and In the Presence of Enemies.  Lots of good stuff here.

However, it is going to take a few listens to completely process it and it's arrangement, which doesn't grab me right now, but that may change.

Far, far, far better than AVFTTOTW

In my opinion!

The shadow self, the Jungian Shadow, very cool concept to explore in an epic. Unfortunately, for me anyway, it didn't really hit the mark. It feels like a bunch of ideas for other songs just randomly smashed together. Themes/riffs posited then abandoned; honestly the track feels like it needs another 6 months in the studio.

Also- re shadows: what a missed opportunity to explore some call and response, or some stereo imaging, or something, SOMETHING creative, something beyond the hacky orthogonal riffing and shredding that's become a hallmark of JP's Dream Theater.

Love this track! I was hoping for an all-out, high-energy ride, and they absolutely delivered. The intensity stays high throughout, and they executed it beautifully. The chorus hits perfectly for me, and the instrumental is pure 🔥🔥🔥.

Can we also take a moment to appreciate how DT always nails the epic? Somehow, they keep finding fresh, exciting ways to approach the epics.

And that ending — perfection. I'm a sucker for grand, climactic outros, and this one fully delivered. In contrast, I felt both IT and AVFTTOTW didn't quite reach the explosive finale I was hoping for.

I never knew there was a thing such as shadow people before I heard about this track, so the concept is new to me.

Lyrically it could've been a track off Systematic Chaos with the fantasy themes. Needs more spins before I can make a fair judgement of it.

Quote from: genome on February 07, 2025, 04:58:10 AMFar, far, far better than AVFTTOTW

In my opinion!

It's the most interesting song on the album, but I don't think it even sniffs AVFTTOTW at this early stage.

I hear bits from Illumination Theory, A View and, mostly, In the Presence of Enemies here. Not sure how it'll go against the other epics in time, but it's clearly the best PS song along with BTC

Although I love all of DT's epics, I still have most and lease favorites.  I'm not yet sure where TSMI will fall, but currently it sits somewhere in the middle.

My favorites are:
In the Presence of Enemies
A View From the Top of the World

And my least favorites are:
Octavarium
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence

Quote from: genome on February 07, 2025, 04:58:10 AMFar, far, far better than AVFTTOTW

In my opinion!

I...agree with you.

The instrumental section from around 12:30 to 15:45 is so awesome - my favourite part of the album so far.

CTHULHU METAL, let's fucking go! 

Jordan on the solo section of the song:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Dreamtheater/comments/1ijqg2l/mr_rudess_on_the_shadow_man_incident_the_solo/

Quote from: MinistroRaven on February 07, 2025, 07:17:59 AMJordan on the solo section of the song:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Dreamtheater/comments/1ijqg2l/mr_rudess_on_the_shadow_man_incident_the_solo/

lol!

This song kind of sucks?? Now we know why the reviews didn't mention it lmao. Oh well I'll keep the name anyway

Quote from: Shadowmangini on February 07, 2025, 07:52:06 AMThis song kind of sucks?? Now we know why the reviews didn't mention it lmao. Oh well I'll keep the name anyway

I'm not sure what you mean, plenty of reviews mentioned it.

Where I am on this one so far:  There are a lot of cool parts that I really like.  But as a single, cohesive piece, it hasn't clicked for me yet.  So, as a song, it's probably my least favorite on the album so far.  But I expect that that will change when I have had a chance to really absorb it.  And I'm sure seeing it live will help as well.  But throughout the thing, I was constantly saying, "Oh, this part's cool," "Oh, that part's cool."  So I'm sure it will start to climb once it all gels.

I've only listened to this once, but I enjoyed it. There was only one moment that I scratched my head and wondered about its inclusion, especially because it wasn't reprised in any way (that I recall). It's what I'm calling the "imperial march" section. I half expected to hear James belt out, "Brother can you hear me..."

Quote from: bosk1 on February 07, 2025, 08:20:50 AMWhere I am on this one so far:  There are a lot of cool parts that I really like.  But as a single, cohesive piece, it hasn't clicked for me yet.  So, as a song, it's probably my least favorite on the album so far.  But I expect that that will change when I have had a chance to really absorb it.  And I'm sure seeing it live will help as well.  But throughout the thing, I was constantly saying, "Oh, this part's cool," "Oh, that part's cool."  So I'm sure it will start to climb once it all gels.

This is me as well.

After reading through the lyrics, it seems JP was referencing a few different parasomnias in this song.  The shadow people, sleep paralysis, and feeling as though someone/something is sitting on your chest.

When I experienced "seeing" the shadow people when I was young, I never had sleep paralysis or the feeling of someone sitting on my chest.

Some details in the song compared to what I remember:

the ones I saw were also shapeless (most of the time).  They were tall, slender and fuzzy around the edges and no discernible physical traits including arms, head or legs (again, most of the time).

Always came out of a dark corner of the room or some other dark part of the room.  Once I did have one come through the door and walk up beside me a night when I was too scared to sleep in my own bed and was in my parents bed instead.

And from what I can recollect, it seemed to me to be more than a dream.  I believe I was awake (except in the one instance I mentioned in my OP).

Anyway, I thought I'd compare my own experience with what was said in the lyrics.  I don't know if anyone else but me finds this kind of thing interesting, but I thought I'd mention it.

And it's because of these experiences that I was afraid of the dark clear into my late 20s.

My first impression I like it better than ITPOE, TCOT, IT and A View. It may change but highly unlikely.

When epic matters I mostly consider every aspect as a whole. While I think ITPOE and TCOT musically better than The Shadow Man Incident they are lyrically worse. IT and A View are lyrcially somewhat good or even better but musically fail.

But TSMI sounds like DT's root (especially ACOS and Octavarium) is here and in the same time it gives something new to the table. I must add that vocal melodies are tasteful than other epics. It may have been had more vocals on it but it's still ok.

Overture 1928 at the beginning, anyone?

Quote from: DragonAttack on February 07, 2025, 10:30:01 AMOverture 1928 at the beginning, anyone?

Yep.  I wonder if that was an intentional through back.

I really like the chorus ("Night, it will be forever changed"), too bad it only occurs twice in a 19 minute song. 

Quote from: Zydar on February 07, 2025, 11:59:37 AMI really like the chorus ("Night, it will be forever changed"), too bad it only occurs twice in a 19 minute song.

The chorus immediately reminded me of "Meet The Past" by ACT (verse):

Does anyone else hear "the best of times" piano motif in the beginning playing on the music box?   It has to be intentional

I'd like to share a few things about the song:
- 1:47 - 2:53 The epic sounding marching snares part doesn't fit right IMO. Besides, it sounds kinda like AVFTTOTW.

- 2:53 - 3:38 Same as before. I find this part especially bad because it appears out of nowhere. Is it cool and fun? Yes.

- 10:57 to 11:32 Those almost 30 seconds are extremely rough to be honest. Unless this was made on purpose, there is no other way in my mind to justify so many changes. The build up section that precedes this section (10:01 - 10:57) makes a bit more sense because of the epic sounding intro. To be fair, I'm still trying to figure out if those rough changes were intentional or not.


The rest of the song is great and fun. I'm hearing a lot of Octavarium, some WDADU, and even a bit of Haken I really like James Labrie's performance throughout the album, and especially in this song.

Also, TSMI doesn't follow the "Action/Big Break/Action" model from previous epics such as TCOT, IT and AVFTTOTW. Instead, it tries to replicate the Octavarium formula which is nice.

Overall, I think it is a "good" epic but unfortunately has some issues in the middle plus some extra fat at the beginning. I give it a "good enough out of ten".

Quote from: lightbug on February 07, 2025, 04:20:20 PMI'd like to share a few things about the song:
- 1:47 - 2:53 The epic sounding marching snares part doesn't fit right IMO. Besides, it sounds kinda like AVFTTOTW.

Love the little cymbal hit just as it starts.

This is actually one of my favorite parts of the song. Of the album, in fact.

Quote from: TAC on February 07, 2025, 06:34:20 PMLove the little cymbal hit just as it starts.

This is actually one of my favorite parts of the song. Of the album, in fact.

I agree, it's great!

I've listened to this song a few more times and I think it's beginning to click, and it's starting to sound less disjointed to me.

And I'm beginning to appreciate certain parts more.

I think the solo break section is my favorite part of the song. Some of the riffs and rhythms are super memorable.

It's the most fun epic, all guns blazin. It's one of the few instances In dt discography where I think the fun aspect does for a lack of cohesion or big epic climax like octavarium. I wouldn't call it a masterpiece, but it's close enough, hope to hear them play it live soon.

This is a great combo of A View from the Top of the World and the count of Tuscany. Throw in The Astonishing and Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence and even some forsaken dark ass vibes. I love how they develop the middle theme. Reminds me of DT 12 illumination theory vibes and then Jordan takes it into this galaxy vibe into a nightmare to remember meets Iron Maiden then into brutal riffs with Jordan's finesse. Throw some Octavarium, pick a new style for some old-school style jams reminiscent of times past, throw some YYZ vibes and then somehow launch into it when dream and day unite. Then into the astonishing meets nightmare to remember back to the shadow man vibe into an insane Jordan outro, then some seriously spooky, turning hopeful vocals that effortlessly transition emotion. Into an epic John Petrucci outro solo and section. And such a cool ending the Voice at the end is so creepy.

I really love the mix on this album despite with some are saying I happen to love Myungs tone, and the way it sits

I mean, this is some inspired stuff.

I didn't really get the song on the first listen. Now after 3 spins I think it's a veeeery cool epic.

The part where they suddenly burst into that 16th-notes staccato riff and Jordan starts building up his piano solo is just.. wow. It feels like I'm playing an old school Sega game and I'm encountering the final boss fight.

Quote from: PixelDream on February 08, 2025, 12:03:18 AMThe part where they suddenly burst into that 16th-notes staccato riff and Jordan starts building up his piano solo is just.. wow. It feels like I'm playing an old school Sega game and I'm encountering the final boss fight.

Agreed. I love the really harmonically weird part before it too. Reminds me of a Final Fantasy soundtrack

Quote from: durga2112 on February 07, 2025, 07:16:56 AMCTHULHU METAL, let's fucking go! 

Love the Lovecraft quote.